I finally, after a year of puzzlement, have got the electrical side of my Force 10, 7 gallon hot water maker working. Saturday was a cold and windy day here in RI and I really wanted a nasty PITA project that would take a whole day. Let me say that the Force 10 7 gallon water heater is BY FAR the most egregious example of bad industrial design, poor construction, and stupid installation that I have ever encountered. This is my story. Starting with an almost entirely useless owners manual, I was not able to identify any of the operating components which are turned toward the aft in a 28 TE with very limited access through a panel just aft of the helm. The actual configuration when viewed from the side is like this:
The top Therm-o-disc, #1 ( a simple on-off bimetal temperature switch, or thermostat) was secured to the unisulated interior metal tank with red RTV high temperature silocone (found in the auto section of hardware store) and is wired in series with a second identical Therm-o-disc (#2) that is secured with two tiny nuts, placed too close to the body of the disc to allow the application of even a tiny wrench or socket. Plan on an hour of turning the nuts one flat at a time with a tiny needle nose vise grip. Note: They will probably be corroded, and one of mine snapped off the tank. So what? Well ground (green wire)to the body of the Therm-o-disc and to the tank is supplied through that post, so don't break both of them if you have to remove. You can test all components right in place however with a continuity tester. There will probably be splices between the AC feed and the water heater wiring. Be sure power is off to unit, disconnect shore power and then cut out the the three splices, saving them, or disconnect at the junction box if installed. Be sure the water in the tank is cold or the tank is empty and attach your tester to the black & white wire coming from the tank. If you have a complete circuit, then the unit is OK. It's the wiring or in my case, one of the splices. I saved the splices as above and checked them and sure enough one of the splices was bad, one wire crimped into the splice was not stripped! I only discovered this after tearing all the other elements apart and testing separately. Alas! If you don't have continuity, remove the connecting wires from the Water Heater Element and use your continuity tester across the two screw connectors. No continuity here means burnt out element. You can get a new element at a plumbing supply or larger hardware store (Home Depot if you must). Removal of the old element is a royal PITA, as it is probably frozen in place and a good angle to get some muscle on it is impossible. DO NOT buy the cheapo ($5) tool
at the depot to remove the element, you need a real 1-1/2 inch socket with a 3/4" drive ratchet, with about a 18" handle. The cheapo tool was the basis of much frustration, banged knuckles, and itchy scratches on my arms from the semi-finished fiberglass edges of the opening. Go to a local rental place (Taylor Rental around here) and rent the giant socket & ratchet ($4 for an hour). Took the element out first pull, beautiful! Replace the burnt element with a similar wattage (1500W, $8.95), rewire and you should be all set.
If it's either of the therm-o-discs, they can also be replaced easily enough although I didn't source them as mine were fine. They work by simply pressing their temp sensitive parts against the outside of the metal tank, and open the circuit when the tank reaches temp. I assume there are two for a fail safe situation, so as to not boil the water in the tank if one failed when closed or the water level was not high enough.
Why in god's name Albin did not install this piece of equipment turned 90 degrees clockwise so all the important things faced out at you I'll never understand. I hope you never have to work on this shoddy little device, but I hope that if you do, this will help!
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Force 10 Water Heater
Moderator: Jeremyvmd
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- Gold Member
- Posts: 1209
- Joined: Sat Dec 02, 2006 10:06 am
- Location: Wickford RI
- Contact:
Force 10 Water Heater
Ric Murray
Big Time, 42' 1993 Jersey Sportfish
Formerly owned Time After Time, 2003 28TE
Wickford RI
Big Time, 42' 1993 Jersey Sportfish
Formerly owned Time After Time, 2003 28TE
Wickford RI
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- Gold Member
- Posts: 411
- Joined: Mon Apr 17, 2006 1:40 pm
- Home Port: Boston, MA
- Location: Boston
- Contact:
H20 Heater died
Hi Ric. My water heater went kaput this weekend. No leaks, stays hot when the engine heats it but the electric elements don't work. Sound like the unit needs replacing?
Rick
Rick
Rick
1998 Albin 35TE
"Legacy"
1998 Albin 35TE
"Legacy"
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- Gold Member
- Posts: 1209
- Joined: Sat Dec 02, 2006 10:06 am
- Location: Wickford RI
- Contact:
Water heater
The electric side of the water heater is pretty simple. Is it one of the square Force 10 units? Check the breaker first. If the breaker's not tripped and there is AC to the unit then it's either the element or the thermostat. If you can wait until the 20th I'll bring my meter!
Ric Murray
Big Time, 42' 1993 Jersey Sportfish
Formerly owned Time After Time, 2003 28TE
Wickford RI
Big Time, 42' 1993 Jersey Sportfish
Formerly owned Time After Time, 2003 28TE
Wickford RI
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- Deckhand
- Posts: 5
- Joined: Tue Nov 18, 2008 2:34 pm
- Location: Annapolis, Maryland
Re: Force 10 Water Heater
Greetings
Thanks for sharing your hard work. I have a simpler need. All the Albin winterizers here warn to drain the hot water heater. But as I haven't found it, I haven't drained it. You say it's behind a panel just aft of the helm? Have you ever attempted to drain the misplaced thing?
thanks again
Thanks for sharing your hard work. I have a simpler need. All the Albin winterizers here warn to drain the hot water heater. But as I haven't found it, I haven't drained it. You say it's behind a panel just aft of the helm? Have you ever attempted to drain the misplaced thing?
thanks again
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- Gold Member
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- Joined: Sat Dec 02, 2006 10:06 am
- Location: Wickford RI
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Re: Force 10 Water Heater
Yes, there is a removable panel between the helm seat and the helm. It is L shaped and makes up part of the deck and the side wall. I believe 4 screws. Being a basically lazy SOB the idea of disconnecting the hot water lines and doing a bypass to pump anti-freeze through the hot water lines and drain the heater seems like another PITA that I don't need. I just buy a ton of -50 and pump it right through the heater. While this requires a lot of juice, I save it in the spring (just pump it back into the jugs) and then use it in the toilet, holding tank, deck hatch drains etc. the next year. Whenever I undo a hose clamp there's always a leak or something that turns up and requires another trip to West or the Depot.
Ric Murray
Big Time, 42' 1993 Jersey Sportfish
Formerly owned Time After Time, 2003 28TE
Wickford RI
Big Time, 42' 1993 Jersey Sportfish
Formerly owned Time After Time, 2003 28TE
Wickford RI
- furball
- Gold Member
- Posts: 352
- Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2007 8:51 am
- Home Port: Chester, Md
- Location: Castle Harbor Marina
- Contact:
Re: Force 10 Water Heater
bayweeklyeditor
I have a flushdeck and the heater drain is accessed by opening the engine hatch and you should find it between the seawater strainer and the fuel filter just outside the starboard stringer. You can also see it if you remove the helm storage cabinet and look forward. It's looks like a garden hose drain valve on the lower left corner of the heater.
Good luck,
John
I have a flushdeck and the heater drain is accessed by opening the engine hatch and you should find it between the seawater strainer and the fuel filter just outside the starboard stringer. You can also see it if you remove the helm storage cabinet and look forward. It's looks like a garden hose drain valve on the lower left corner of the heater.
Good luck,
John
Chief
2005 31TE
Cummins 450
Formerly,
Transition
2006 28TE
Yanmar 6LP
2005 31TE
Cummins 450
Formerly,
Transition
2006 28TE
Yanmar 6LP
- jcollins
- In Memorium
- Posts: 4927
- Joined: Sun Apr 16, 2006 9:05 pm
- Home Port: Baltimore
- Location: Seneca Creek Marina
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Re: Force 10 Water Heater
Me too. I run the water until it's empty, then pour 6 gallons into the holding tank. Open the hot water faucet until it runs pink. It's not the proper way, but I haven't lost a water heater yet. Now that I'm bragging, it will break.RicM wrote:Yes, there is a removable panel between the helm seat and the helm. It is L shaped and makes up part of the deck and the side wall. I believe 4 screws. Being a basically lazy SOB the idea of disconnecting the hot water lines and doing a bypass to pump anti-freeze through the hot water lines and drain the heater seems like another PITA that I don't need. I just buy a ton of -50 and pump it right through the heater. While this requires a lot of juice, I save it in the spring (just pump it back into the jugs) and then use it in the toilet, holding tank, deck hatch drains etc. the next year. Whenever I undo a hose clamp there's always a leak or something that turns up and requires another trip to West or the Depot.
John
Former - 28 TE Convertible"Afterglow"
Former - 28 TE Convertible"Afterglow"