Vacuflush toilet - potential failure?

[scarbo]

I have a Vacuflush in my 2005 28TE, probably installed by the dealer for the first owner. It uses fresh water from the boat's pressurized system, and has an electric vacuum generator that has to be run before every flush. The literature says "no odor" since it is fresh water, but it still smells like rotten eggs now and then. Also says "less than one pint per flush", but it looks like alot more to me.

So far it has worked fine, but I don't like several things about it:

1. It uses precious fresh water.
2. The vacuum generator is in that nightmare area under the helm chair that is nearly impossible to get to.
3. It doesn't appear owner-friendly in case of failure, which I know will happen eventually...at at the worst time and place. (I do bring along a $60 plastic camper toilet, just in case.)

I am tempted to just tear it out and put in a high-quality manual salt water toilet, but before I do, I'd like to know if anyone has had a failure with a Vacuflush, and if so, what part(s) failed? Do you still use it?
What spare parts do you take with you now?

[jcollins]

scarbo,
Here's an article I found from a vacuflush dealer. Pretty interesting insight. I don't have one myself. If your bothered by the odor you have now, don't switch to a manual sea water flush unit. Talk about rotten eggs!

Here's the article

When I still owned my company, we were VacuFlush dealers for nearly 10
years...I also had VacuFlush toilets on my last two boats. So I'm
intimately acquainted with 'em.

Most problems with VacuFlush are "operator-inflicted"--mostly due to
incomplete flushing, which in turn is due to misleading directions from
SeaLand.... Their claim that the V/Flush can use "as little as" one pint
of flush water is interpreted by most to mean that's ALL the flush water
it EVER needs. So most users just "pop" the pedal...releasing it the
instant the bowl is empty....when in fact, it's necessary to leave the
pedal down anywhere from 3-10 seconds to send enough flush water down
behind the bowl contents to rinse waste and TP out of the vacuum pump.
They build up, clogging the bellows till it no longer has enough room to
move, which puts strain on the motor...waste also sticks in the
duckbills, creating air leaks that can cause the pump to cycle or even
run continuously, which can burn out the motor.

When the toilet is flushed, the suction splatters waste all over the
inside of the hoses and vacuum tank. What SeaLand doesn't tell you is
that no matter how long you leave your foot on the pedal, the flow of
flush water isn't sufficient to completely fill the hoses...the best you
can do is rinse the bottom of the vacuum tank and the bottom half of the
hose. So the only way to completely rinse out the system is to flush a
bowlfull--fill the bowl all the way to the rim--down the toilet...how
often depends on how much the toilet is used, but at the very least, any
time the boat will sit unused for even a day. I've always recommended
two bowlfuls.

Most owners also make the mistake of easing the pedal back up...they're
afraid to just let it go. It's spring-loaded for a reason--to allow the
dome in the bowl to go back into place with enough force to seat
completely. When the pedal is repeatedly eased up after flushing, over
time the dome no longer seats...the bowl no longer holds water...the
spring is no longer capable of putting the dome all the way back into
place...the assembly then has to be replaced.

It's also necessary when you clean the bowl to wipe off the underside of
the opening to remove any bits of waste or TP that can get stuck to it
and prevent the dome from sealing.

NEVER use bleach, or any household chemical toilet bowl cleaners...any
products containing petroleum, pine oil or other solvents in a VacuFlush
or any other marine toilet. They're all highly destructive to rubber and
hoses.

> one interesting comment made by the Head Honch was that VacuFlush
> units should be serviced (meaning replace the duckbills, bellows,
> etc.) every couple of years (there is nothing in the owners manual
> about this) for trouble free operation.

I disagree, Al. One of the few advantages to a VacuFlush is that it
doesn't require any preventive maintenance. When the pump starts to
cycle between for no reason, that usually means it's time to replace the
duckbills. Depending on how much the toilet is used, that can take
anywhere from a year to 5 years to happen. I'm a big believer in
preventive maintenance...but when it comes to V/Flush, "if it ain't
broke, don't mess with it"...'cuz often that can create problems you
didn't have.

Larry, the actual VacuFlush system ends at the vacuum pump...anything
installed after the vacuum pump isn't part of the VacuFlush
toilet...it's only where the flush ultimately ends up--which can be a
thru-hull, treatment device, or holding tank...no different from where
any other toilet would send it.

> The second problem was a bit unique. My holding tank began taking on
> seawater. Eventually it would fill within 24 hours without using the
> VacuFlush. What had happened was the 2 duck valves in the discharge
> pump assembly had failed as well as the seacock.

That's not the vacuum pump in your VacuFlush toilet, but the overboard
discharge pump (if a SeaLand, their T-Series pump) in your tank pumpout
line. It has nothing to do with the VacuFlush...in fact, isn't even in a
hose that's connected to the toilet.

As for your TankWatch tank monitors...I've never seen a SeaLand tank
level monitor last more than a few years. If the wiring doesn't fail,
the sender does. If it's a sender problem, it's usually due a buildup of
animal fats (present in waste) that clog and insulate it. A strong
solution of low suds detergent in the holding tank (Wisk is good...avoid
dishwashing liquids because they suds too much) for a day or two should
emulsifying 'em, preventing the need to remove the sender to clean it.
When cleaning no longer works, it's time for a new sender...or a whole
new gauge.

I'm a HUGE fan of the Snake River AcuGage systems.... On all tank
materials except metal, the sender goes on the outside of the tank...the
internaal sender required in metal tanks is encased in a pvc tube. So
the sender never comes in contact with tank contents. Their 4 tank
system, which can combine any combination of diesel, water and/or waste
in a single system costs less than most single tank guages that do more
than let you know when the tank is full, and they last for literally
decades. Before replacing a failed SeaLand with another SeaLand or other
brand, check 'em out on their website at http://www.snake-river.org (I
have no connection with 'em whatever, btw (or with any other mfr of
ANYthing any more)...I just like 'em a LOT.

Peggie
----------
Peggie Hall
Specializing in marine sanitation since 1987
Author "Get Rid of Boat Odors - A Guide To Marine Sanitation Systems and
Other Sources of Aggravation and Odor"

[StockHR]

Scarbo

Two seasons ago I installed two Vacuflush toilets and two separate holding tanks in “MaryGrace.” I can say that I have had no problems with any part of the toilets or the holding tanks. You are correct in saying that it uses more than a pint to flush. However, since I was restricted in space I could only install two 10 Gallon holding tanks and that capacity seems to be enough for cruising and spending extended time on the hook. In fact last season we took a one-week cruise to the Hyatt in Cambridge, MD and I only pumped out as we were leaving because it was convenient to do so.

There is no maintenance involved, however if you can keep an eye on the hose clamps I have already noticed a couple have started to rust even though they are stainless. If you start to notice the pump cycling on and off it means you are loosing pressure somewhere and it is usually the clamps. Also, all fittings must be double clamped.

As Peggy says the duckbill will wear out over time but that is normal in any toilet system. Peggy Hall is the absolute expert in boating toilets and she is correct in her advice in using Vacuflush toilets. You should be able to regulate by the valve, the amount of fresh water used in each average flush and only raise the foot petal when needed. The air filter being clogged might cause the odor, or no filter installed.

I tore out two original toilets and the holding tank and installed the 2 systems myself so if I can be of any help please ask. And I’m sure you know but you can’t use salt water with the Vacuflush system.

Mike

[scarbo]

Thank you both for your excellent advise. Sounds like I ought to spend a little time tracing all the lines around and get a spare set of duckbills and clamps.