Albin 25 tow vehicles in Europe

[tribologist]

Mine is 5970 lb fully loaded according to the cat scale. Tows fine with 2010 sequioa rated for 9700 lb.

[DesertAlbin736]

When we first brought our boat down from Idaho I put the rig (aluminum trailer, disconnected from the truck) on a truck scale & measured 6,050 lbs with a 70 lb dinghy hanging off the stern. Our tow vehicle is a Ram 2500 4X4 diesel that weighs 7,000 lbs empty. One could certainly get away with a 1/2 ton vehicle in most cases, but out here in the west we have to deal with serious 6% long mountain grades. No such thing as having too much towing capacity.

[Bob Noodat]

Those weights seem pretty consistent. Say 4800lbs to 5000lbs plus trailer. Again, 1000lbs lighter than my guess from eyeballing one.

I will confess that the Sequoia does have the weight and power for the job, basically just pulling its own weight, which should be a safe ratio.

In Britain I have seen (many years ago!) short wheelbase Landrovers pulling ten times their own weight. But usually at tractor speeds. It probably doesn't happen these days.

[DesertAlbin736]

One of our scariest episodes was towing our previous boat, a Catalina 25 sailboat which tipped truck scale at 8,300 lbs including steel trailer, from Phoenix to San Diego in 2008 via I-8 with a Chevy Tahoe. For those not familiar with that route the last 115 mile stretch from El Centro, CA to Chula Vista at the south end of San Diego Bay goes from below sea level at El Centro climbing to a series of summits that top out at 4500 ft & back down to sea level at the coast. That was a big incentive to trade in for a 3/4 ton pickup.

[NickScheuer]

I've heard that Builders' advertised hull weights are often not accurate, but 5000lbs versus 3500 is ridiculous. Not an issue here as we tow with a Dodge 250 Diesel that will tow the DuNORD ANTWHERE. It's an old 1993 12-valve Cummins and this truck is a WAY better tractor than the 2000 Silverado gasser it replaced. The Silverado 330 ci (?) v-8 couldn't pull our old Shearwater Yawl up the western mountains with the AC running without overheating. The Dodge has the torque to tow up a mountain without downshifting from third to second gear (automatic).

[Bob Noodat]

I've heard that Builders' advertised hull weights are often not accurate, but 5000lbs versus 3500 is ridiculous. Not an issue here as we tow with a Dodge 250 Diesel that will tow the DuNORD ANTWHERE. It's an old 1993 12-valve Cummins and this truck is a WAY better tractor than the 2000 Silverado gasser it replaced. The Silverado 330 ci (?) v-8 couldn't pull our old Shearwater Yawl up the western mountains with the AC running without overheating. The Dodge has the torque to tow up a mountain without downshifting from third to second gear (automatic).

The Silverado would have been a 350ci. It should not have overheated, since they are well cooled, but would have been working so hard as to give you terrible gas mileage in any case. We had that engine in a Suburban 2500 pulling a stock trailer with two large draft horses, altogether close to 10,000 lbs. It was no problem, but gas mileage dropped from 16ish to 6mpg. Then I bought a Ford F250 with the high torque 460ci engine and fuel economy was about 10mpg. With my Duramax I have towed 14,000 lbs and still git 12 mpg. Torque is the big factor and the Cummins is a great engine for torque, despite only being 5.9 litres or about 360ci.

[DesertAlbin736]

Nick writes: I've heard that Builders' advertised hull weights are often not accurate, but 5000lbs versus 3500 is ridiculous. Not an issue here as we tow with a Dodge 250 Diesel that will tow the DuNORD ANYWHERE. It's an old 1993 12-valve Cummins and this truck is a WAY better tractor than the 2000 Silverado gasser it replaced. The Silverado 330 ci (?) v-8 couldn't pull our old Shearwater Yawl up the western mountains with the AC running without overheating. The Dodge has the torque to tow up a mountain without downshifting from third to second gear (automatic).

Shearwater yawl? Did you ever hang out on the Trailer Sailor forum?

A Dodge man after my own heart! Our Ram 2500 Laramie 4X4 is a 2006 model, the last year of the 5.9 Cummins before they went to 6.7L and added the DPF emissions stuff where you have to add Blue Def fluid. Traded in my previous 2007 Chevy Tahoe (350 V8) for the Dodge in February 2011, nine years ago to the day. Best vehicle I've ever owned, and pretty much holds personal lifetime record of longest years of single vehicle ownership in 50 years of driving. It had 78K miles on the odometer then and 148K now.

20190615_114110.jpg

So Nick, your Dodge "...will tow the DuNORD ANYWHERE"? How about the 628 miles to Tonawanda, or the 782 miles to Brewerton, NY, either one an easy two day run, and do the Triangle Loop with us? There's a boat yard & ramp in Brewerton that will store truck & trailer for $75 a month.

triangleloopmap.jpg

ottowa locks.jpg

Jones falls lock.jpg

[NickScheuer]

Thanks Bob! We really believe in our 5.9L Cummins; for my money the best engine ever installed in a towing pickup truck. The manual with my 1993 says it's rated for towing 16,000 lbs, when the factory transmission cooler is installed. Ours isn't that, so kthe rated limit is something like 12,000. We have an aftermarket cooler.
As the Chevy engine, I believe we had what used to be the 350, before they downrated it a bit to something like 328 or 330 ci.

[Bob Noodat]

Thanks Bob! We really believe in our 5.9L Cummins; for my money the best engine ever installed in a towing pickup truck. The manual with my 1993 says it's rated for towing 16,000 lbs, when the factory transmission cooler is installed. Ours isn't that, so kthe rated limit is something like 12,000. We have an aftermarket cooler.
As the Chevy engine, I believe we had what used to be the 350, before they downrated it a bit to something like 328 or 330 ci.

Now I understand your Chevy problem. After the 5.7 litre 350ci was discontinued, they put a slightly larger 6 litre V8 in, so 366ci, and provided an economical smaller V8, the 5.3 litre or 323ci. The 323 was never claimed to be a towing engine, so it is hardly remarkable that it overheated pulling probably 6000 lbs.

The Cummins is a fine engine. To claim it is the finest might well lead to a religious controversy. Suffice it to say that the non-turbo Ford Powerstroke 7.3 litre and the 6.6 litre Isuzu/GM Duramax have similar support from others.

[Bob Noodat]

Duplicated post

[DesertAlbin736]

The Cummins is a fine engine. To claim it is the finest might well lead to a religious controversy. Suffice it to say that the non-turbo Ford Powerstroke 7.3 litre and the 6.6 litre Isuzu/GM Duramax have similar support from others.

My late stepdad was a die hard GM fan, mostly drove Buick Rivieras. I was never all that enthused about MoPar products. Although back around 1970 I owned a 1963 Plymouth Fury convertible with a 318 V8, which today a restored one would be worth $50K as a collector. But my stepdad was also a very skilled diesel mechanic & former long haul trucker (in his younger days back in the late 1940s-early '50s.) & always swore by Cummins diesels. That's what primarily influenced my choice to pick the Dodge Ram. Have been pleasantly surprised not only with the engine, towing, and mileage but also the overall build quality of the truck all the way around. Even peripheral items like A/C, dashboard control switches. Transmissions have have been considered their weak point, but I haven't had any problems, knock on wood, with the exception of needing to replace front diff ball joints, which other than normal maintenance, tires, batteries, & oil changes that was the only major repair so far. Hope to hang on to this truck as long as I have a need for a tow vehicle. A new one similarly equipped would be over $60K and this one is paid for & barely broken in.

[Bob Noodat]

My late stepdad was a die hard GM fan, mostly drove Buick Rivieras. I was never all that enthused about MoPar products. Although back around 1970 I owned a 1963 Plymouth Fury convertible with a 318 V8, which today a restored one would be worth $50K as a collector. But my stepdad was also a very skilled diesel mechanic & former long haul trucker (in his younger days back in the late 1940s-early '50s.) & always swore by Cummins diesels. That's what primarily influenced my choice to pick the Dodge Ram. Have been pleasantly surprised not only with the engine, towing, and mileage but also the overall build quality of the truck all the way around. Even peripheral items like A/C, dashboard control switches. Transmissions have have been considered their weak point, but I haven't had any problems, knock on wood, with the exception of needing to replace front diff ball joints, which other than normal maintenance, tires, batteries, & oil changes that was the only major repair so far. Hope to hang on to this truck as long as I have a need for a tow vehicle. A new one similarly equipped would be over $60K and this one is paid for & barely broken in.

I have learned to avoid "best truck" discussions. Seen too many of them deteriorate badly. I am sure your Fiat is a great truck

Trucks these days are a ridiculous price. They sustain GM and to a lesser extent Ford and Fiat. General Motors makes a clear profit of over US$22,000 for each and every full size pick up and SUV it builds! Thus I shall not be buying a new truck any time soon, or ever, but luckily my '01 Duramax with nigh on 300,000 miles and not a single major repair except for new injectors keeps soldiering on, not burning oil, still starting at 40 below and still with the same power and economy. I am not sure that a new one would last as well anyway.

[DesertAlbin736]

To put the issue to rest I'm not saying Dodges are necessarily any better than Fords, GMs, Toyotas, or any other make or model. Just saying what my experience with my particular truck has been. I was lucky to stumble across a deal on a low mileage 5 year old truck at less than half the cost of a new one with 4WD & "loaded" with top of the line options to boot even including heated 6 way power leather seats, hands free Bluetooth speaker phone, built in navigation. The only thing missing besides the nav system running off a stand alone DVD disk ( which costs $150 to update) & not internet connected is not having rear view camera video. Another unit of the same make, model, and year as mine could turn out to be a lemon. To paraphrase Pvt Gomer in Full Metal Jacket, "This is my truck. There are others like it but this one is mine". Yes new trucks are ridiculously expensive, especially those with diesel engines. So are new boats. That's why we love & fuss so much over our ancient A25s & A27s. Let's face it, 35, 40, & 50 year old boats are antiques.

[Bob Noodat]

Well, DA, you and I and no doubt most people on this sub-forum are letting capitalism down badly.

The people who are necessary to keep the system cranking at ever higher speed are the ones who do spend 60, 70, or 100k on a new truck. Or buy the $500,000 boat. I have no problem with that at all, just could not do it myself, but I am always ready to admire someone's new and shiny toy, or tell them they have the prettiest baby or smartest child that I have ever seen. It's a pleasure to make someone's day so easily, just with a positive word, after all.

On the antique theme, people who visit us here often say that we have wonderful antique furniture. I tell them truthfully that when we bought it, it was merely the second hand stuff that we could afford. You just have to keep it long enough.

I am going to have to ask you about trailer choice next, be warned. I am beginning to think that I am very unlikely to find an A25 with a trailer.

[WillieC]

What's 7 Large for a brand new trailer? For your antique boat. You already have the truck. In our infinite wisdom, we didn't even have a truck but we forked over cash for a trailer then imposed on our very good friends to borrow their truck just to get it home! Thimk Ahead. The fellow across the street from my eldest son had a 97Ford 7.3 Powerstroke, 2WD and I foolishly mentioned one afternoon over beers that that would be the truck for hauling the Willster. Good enough for our purposes. 4WD would be better, but... the price was right.

Yeah, we A25 owners aren't going to save modern civilization from economic collapse. AND, there is nothing particularly green about boats, as far back, and much farther, than Noah's tar/pitch slathered ark. It's a fight out there, what with nature and all.

Finding that boat is tricky, Bob. The cheap ones are back east, the junkers. As you know, there are two ways to do this. Checkbook or sweat, bloody knuckles, and way too much time. Or, pay too much to start and have it both ways! I know that I suffer from the delusion that I am way smarter and faster than your average boat owner or working shop, but then, just to set the record straight, we bought the WillieC. Man's plans and God's chuckles... BUT, in my ignorant defense, there isn't much that will end a trip for us. Well, maybe the...what was the huge guffaw I just heard?

And they all can suffer from a couple years of lackluster maintenance, which all adds up and is rarely discounted. I think we lucked out by settling on the A25 though. I had a co-worker who knew of and praised them. We have been out in rougher conditions than I ever thought I would choose to be in and lived to tell about it. The boat is way more capable than we are.

Be patient. I'll keep my eyes open down here. Keep an eye out on the BCAlbineer's pages. Scour marinas in your spare time. Only a two-day's drive from your neck of the woods. Remember, most of them rarely get over a hunnert hours use each season. The marina queens are also forking over monthly cash. Like you may be doing one day...