My Craigslist A25

[ednlorna]

I was able to purchase a "project" A 25 in Satellite Beach, Florida on March 1. Hull No. 1220, built in 1972. It has the Vetus (Mitsubishi K4E) 4-cylinder diesel engine, which is not running, but does turn over. The vessel has been tied up at the PO's dock for five years.

Here are some photos:

[WillieC]

Let the fun begin!! That's good news that the Vetus turns over. When we got ours the Volvo Penta turned over, easily, by hand, without the compression released. But it RAN and actually ran pretty good, if you didn't mind towing around the spill containment boom that should have come with it. But what did we know, this was our first. She's come a long way since.

Best of luck with the project! Tied up for five years is a very good sign. At least it floats!

[DesertAlbin736]

Congratulations! Let the fun begin indeed! That'll keep you busy for a while for sure. Don't know if you're retired or still working, but when people ask how does one keep busy in retirement my answer is simple, just buy a classic antique boat, especially one that's a restoration project, and that'll keep you plenty busy. Also, when asked how to make a small fortune, that's easy too...start with a large fortune and buy an old boat.

Seriously, the good news with a Vetus engine is the non-marine Mitsu tractor engine parts are much more affordable than say a Yanmar like ours. After sitting for 5 years in Florida's climate hopefully all that needs done with the engine is pull the fuel tank, have it drained & cleaned, flush fuel lines, replace all fuel & oil filters, change oil & fresh water side coolant, check zincs, new raw water pump impeller, adjust valves, etc. Hopefully the fuel injection pump is OK, that's a biggy. Change tranny oil, and repack the prop shaft stuffing box too if it's the old fashioned kind. Hopefully the engine is still in good enough condition to avoid the need for full overhaul. Find a service manual for the engine if one didn't come with the boat, and/or if you're not mechanically inclined then a good marine diesel mechanic. If all of the above is done & it still blows huge clouds of smoke, then hold on to your wallet.

When it comes to cushions and canvas, if you're not already familiar with those items you may be in for sticker shock when it comes to replacing or re-covering. If you're so inclined you can save a lot of money on those items by going the do it yourself route. Beg, borrow, or steal a heavy duty walking foot sewing machine, teach yourself to sew, and find a good source of Sunbrella or similar canvas and upholstery materials. There's an outfit Sailrite.com that sells all that stuff & has a good library of how-to videos on just about every sewing project imaginable. Even going the DIY route the cost of materials alone adds up quick. When it comes to the wood trim, like for example around the aft cabin door, a neat trick to stripping old varnish without the use of harsh chemicals is to carefully heat the wood with a auto mechanic's heat gun, essentially a hair dryer on steroids, to soften the old varnish & scrape off with a paint scraper. Just be careful not to scorch the wood. I'm talking about the solid wood trim here, NOT plywood veneer.

When all is said & done your cabin should look something like this (minus the clutter)

DSCN3634.JPG

Keep us posted on progress & have fun!

[DesertAlbin736]

PS, from what little of the backrest upholstery that can be seen in your shot of the cabin interior, it's likely the original plaid design from the factory, as seen in this screen shot from the A25 sales brochure.

AA 25 sales brochure.jpg

[ednlorna]

Thanks, guys! I really appreciate getting these tips from men who have completed restorations.

Right now I'm working on my trailer (also a CL bargain) so I can wheel my new project home. I'm going with a Dutton-Lainson 2-speed 3,200 hand winch with the ICNuts Company Universal Winch Driver Tool so I can use my electric drill to winch the boat.

Also, I'm going to need to install Kodiac disc brakes and I would like some new wobble rollers. The trailer is basically sound, but needs those items.

I will certainly keep y'all updated with my progress.

Ed

[ednlorna]

Oh, I forgot! I purchased two 12 inch keel rollers and 4 new tires on galvanized rims. As for the Albin, the first order of business is to get a compression test on that Vetus diesel.

DesertAlbin, that must have been a panel or other pieces part you saw in the background, the boat hasn't a scrap of upholster.

[kerrye]

Does that Vetus have glow plugs? If so, I'd check to make sure they are working before checking anything else. Many diesels with glow plugs are extremely reluctant to start if the glow plugs aren't working. Next thing I'd check after that is for fuel delivery.

Edit--Looks like it probably has glowplugs.

[ednlorna]

kerrye:

I did notice there is no indication the glow plugs are functional. My procedure was to hold the glow plug button and count to thirty or so before hitting the starter. There was no indicator light that the glow plugs actually heated up, but I did see indication of a heated wire (smoke) from a connector of wires that led to the glow plugs! Maybe I should have stopped there?

Different throttle/shifter positions didn't seem to help the engine fire, but did show that the starter could turn the shaft, and presumably the prop. After this, I got a loud buzzer and nothing. Was that the overheating alarm? I wonder.

I did notice a can of starting spray in the vessel. I hope the PO wasn't using that stuff. Everyone I talk to says that stuff will kill a diesel engine. I'll have to ask the PO about that.

Anyway, my first order of business will be to do a compression test on the four banger.

Thanks for reading this thread and offering some very good advice!

Ed

[DesertAlbin736]

Have you been able to ascertain any sort of ballpark figure on how many hours this engine has on it, and when it was installed, how old? Did your PO include any paperwork & maintenance records?

On the upholstery question, I shudder to think of the cost of all new upholstery if there weren't even foam cushions left behind to pattern after or re-cover. It's a lot more expensive than you might guess. For example, I do all my own sewing, and recently spent almost $200 on foam, fabric, zippers, & thread just to make box cushions for the cockpit side benches. And that was paying $12 a yard in 54 inch width for Sunbrella upholstery fabric factory seconds from a local supplier when the same fabric sells for $41 a yard from Sailrite.

Am looking to end up with something like this, except maybe the back rest pillows as later project:

GotaA25.jpg

[ednlorna]

Desert Albin:

That plan for "La Dolce Vita" looks absolutely fabulous!

I'm probably going to learn to sew, as you and so many experienced boaters have done. Maybe I'll need to "Break Out Another Thousand"!

My plan, I admit, is copied from AOG member "Smackman." That is: focus on the essential issues effecting the seaworthiness of the vessel, get them fixed and start having fun! I may just rig a hammock once my boat is seaworthy.

Smackman ( I don't recall his name) is an experienced boater from the U.K. who posts extremely informative YouTube videos. For many years he specialized in sailboat deliveries around the British Isles and beyond.

Your YouTube videos and his are the best I found when researching vintage Albins. As you posted, ownership of a vintage boat is how I'm going to stay busy in retirement. As you joked, I'm on my way to making a "small fortune"!

[kerrye]

I agree with your plan on essentials like Smacksman. It's what I did with mine after I bought it and it had been sitting for 8 years.
Before going to the work of a compression test which will involve removing either the glow plugs or the injectors, I would put a voltmeter on the glowplugs to see if they are energized when the button is pushed. If not, I would solve the glowplug problem before doing anything else. The simple existence of power to the glowplugs does not mean they are good, but if there is no power, I'd say that is your starting problem most likely. If the glowplugs are getting power, each individual plug needs to be tested with an ohmeter to determine it's functionality. An even simpler test for power to the glowplugs is to watch your engine voltmeter as you push the glowplug button. They draw a lot of power so you should see the voltmeter drop down as you push the button if they are working. The presence of starting fluid is an indication there is a glow plug problem. If you do ever use starting fluid, make sure there is no power to the glowplugs when you use it because a hot glowplug will cause the starting fluid to ignite at the wrong moment in the cycle and can damage the engine. If there is no power to the glowplugs you can get away with occasional use of starting fluid. Also, my Westerbeke has an electric fuel pump which I can hear clicking when the key is turned on. Does the Vetus have an electric or mechanical lift pump? If electric, can you hear it operating when the key is turned on? Alternatively, can you feel it operating by putting your hand on it when the key is turned on? If not, you may have a fuel delivery issue. Personally I would explore both of these issues before pulling injectors or glow plugs to do a compression test. The reason is that fuel or glowplug issues are much more common problems than compression issues and checking on the fuel and glowplugs is much easier than running a compression test. A simple compression test without removing the glowplugs or injectors would be to put a socket and ratchet on the crank pulling and attempt to turn the engine over by hand. It should be relatively hard to turn over if the compression is decent. If it turns very easily, you have a compression problem.

[WillieC]

I second, third and fourth what kerrye says. Keep It Stupid Simple is my motto, well one of them. An engine designed to start with glow plugs is an engine that needs functional glow plugs. Kerrye describes simple checks for them. You may also find getting a compression test is not as simple as it seems, though I can't speak for the Vetus. I went through a lot to test mine on the Volvo Penta only to find out what the Armstrong method already told me. If you can't spin it by hand, your compression is fine. For now anyway. If you can get hold of the crankshaft somehow. The VP has a hugeass exposed flywheel that simplifies all that. Without looking more closely at your pics, there must be a drive belt and/or pulley accessible that will let you spin the crank. Kerrye says it all.

I often read about diesels that have sat for years and started after a few hours of checking and remedying the basics, clean fuel and filters, bleed the system, change the oil if you think it might actually run, same with all the cooling issues. How many Previous Boat Owners lose heart when something acts up and they don't have the interest, money, or natural curiosity to investigate and take care of what may have been something very basic? Now you get to do all that and you seem to have the right spirit. But do hang on to your wallet at this stage. You're going to need it later, trust me. I recently read on the forum that somebody was looking at one of the newer bigger models and at first blush figured the boat needed about Two Large to bring it up to snuff. After I cleaned up the coffee I sprayed out my nose all over the computer, I had a nice sedate chuckle. Bring Out Another Ten Thousand.

[ednlorna]

No, I haven't determined a ball park on engine hours or even when it was installed. It was two owners back and the last owner doesn't know. I did not see any hour meter.

The reason I wanted a compression test was to see if the engine was a write-off. I was going to get a mobile mechanic to do the test, because I don't have the proper tools to do one. Plan B is to get a good running used diesel. There's a Yanmar YSB8 8hp Diesel Inboard Engine with transmission, shaft and controls, allegedly 224 hours on the clock listed on the local CL for $1,999.

I had by-passed the fuel pump (mechanical) altogether and attached a fuel hose to the injector pump intake. I was using fresh diesel from a clean 3 gallon tank and bled the air out of the system at the injectors.

I like your suggestion to check for current at glow plugs and I will certainly do that. There is no key. The Vetus has a three button system, the glow plug, the starter and the shut-off.

Yes, I've been breaking out the cash left and right! do you know how much wobble rollers go for these days? I'm going to try to do as much of the work myself, but know when to turn to a professional.

My priority is to get my CL trailer up to snuff so the PO can have his dock space. He is a hell of a nice guy and has offered to tow the Albin to the nearest boat ramp this week, so I'm scrambling to get the trailer ready.

Thanks for the help!

[kerrye]

I definitely wouldn't pay for a compression test before more investigation. Do you have a primer bulb in that line to put some pressure into the injection pump? I wouldn't assume the engine is a write off. Diesels are pretty durable. Your engine does not look that old. Do you have a video of trying to start it? I wouldn't put a 8hp diesel in the boat. It's too small. You could put a drop down motor mount on the stern and an outboard to move it around in the meantime. Used outboards are typically pretty cheap as are drop down mounts.

[kerrye]

If your Vetus is like this one it should be easy to get a wrench on the nut on the front of the alternator to attempt to turn it over by hand and see how easily it spins. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NRWBummnBs4