Winterization Issues

[southerncross]

2005 31 TE does not have a drain plug, after what I thought was a complete winterization, checked keel bilge and found frozen solid. Can anyone offer insight as to installing one? Has anyone else found this in the past?
Our 28 TE has a drain plug in keel.

[irishwake]

My 2002 31 has a drain plug in the keel.

[Pitou]

My 2006 did not have a keel pocket bilge drain either and only the same useless transom drain. I added a keel pocket garboard. For those of us in northern climates this is a must do project.

Having the same issue of icing in the keel pocket with the shaft seal completeley iced in I went forward and added a keel pocet garboard because year one I trucked the boat home in December, water got into the keel during transport and the icing resulted in the shaft seal bellows cracking. Why Albin abandoned this drain makes zero sense as al earlier models like IrishWake's had the keel pocket drain. This whole mess meant a new dripless seal needed to be done.

At that time, I added a Perko Garboard 0124000PLB drain positioned at the base of the most bottom point of the bilge keel pocket below the shaft. There was no core, just solid glass.

When the shaft was removed for the shaft seal and cutlass bearing replacementI drilled a pilot hole from the inside out with a right angle drill . Having the shaft removed made this an easy project and since it was out, as preventative maintenance I replaced the cutlass bearing as well. If drilling from the outside, I'd certainly start with a small pilot hole to get the location correct.

During installation, I through bolted the drain flange with stainless bolts and ran a bonding wire to one of the studs. The Perko drain plug is easily removed with a 3/8" drive ratchet.

best of luck with this project and on a scale of difficulty it's one of the easiest and least expensive additions that can be under taken for under $100.00 US.

Perko 0124000PLB.jpg

[southerncross]

Thank you ever so much for your clear and concise update and knowledge into this.
I'm wondering how long was the water frozen in it before you noticed it? Ours sat for about a week, but we don't know if there is any damage yet.

[coolchange]

cheap fix for now could be a few gallons of red antifreeze (safer to get overboard in spring)

[coolchange]

cheap fix for now could be a few gallons of red antifreeze (safer to get overboard in spring)

[johnmurray]

Here in the frozen north (current lows -30C, highs -20C) I pump out any water left in the bilge after haul-out, and then dump in about 40 litres of -50 pink anti-freeze. That is enough to activate the bilge pumps and fill them with ant-freeze, but not empty the bilge. I leave all the residual anti-freeze in the bilge until the spring when I pump it out and clean the bilge. That is quick and easy and seems to work. (My boat is fully covered during the winter so no new water can get in the bilge to dilute the ant-freeze.)
Note: For all other anti-freeze requirements; engine, AC, head, fresh water system, I use the conventional methods of running anti-freeze through the intakes.

[Pitou]

Thank you ever so much for your clear and concise update and knowledge into this.
I'm wondering how long was the water frozen in it before you noticed it? Ours sat for about a week, but we don't know if there is any damage yet.

Because of weather, my transport got delayed and the boat sat mid-trip for about 5 days collecting snow, sleet and rain. When the boat finally arrived the cockpit was covered in a few inches of crunchy ice and snow and the keel pocket had enough icy mess to cover the keel pocket bilge pump & shaft seal. Within a week we had a warm up and using a heat gun I was able to get everything melted and vac'd out before shrink wrapping, but the silicone hose on the shaft seal had been compromised setting into motion what I had described above.

As suggested by John Murray, you can add some non-tox to get things melted and then vac it out and then add some again straight once covered just in case water finds its way there again over the winter. I chose to eliminate the risk if for some reason the shrinkwrap were compromised by adding the drain or for that occassional late season haulout that might put me in a situation that is less than ideal.

[Dr Luke]

Kevin, I was taught that stainless and bronze in contact in a marine environment is a no no due to corrosion. In those situations, the hard to find bronze bolts are the least worrisome... Please verify this independently, as I wouldn't want to be there if there was a failure - plugging the hole with a wood plug may be impossible there !

[Pitou]

Kevin, I was taught that stainless and bronze in contact in a marine environment is a no no due to corrosion. In those situations, the hard to find bronze bolts are the least worrisome... Please verify this independently, as I wouldn't want to be there if there was a failure - plugging the hole with a wood plug may be impossible there !

Paul, Thanks for the call out and I appreciate the concern. Yes, bronze bolts would have been better and I'll try to source them as crevice corossion of the stainless bolts will at some point most likely occur. Currently, the odds for catastrophe are pretty nil as the flange of the drain is heavily bedded in 5200 and going no where.

[Dr Luke]

One source is McMaster-Carr — www.mcmaster.com and search for “silicon bronze bolts”. Reputable supplier of almost anything. Prices not necessarily lowest, but not gouging... if you absolutely can’t find a specialty item, they likely stock it!

[TorreyWP]

cheap fix for now could be a few gallons of red antifreeze (safer to get overboard in spring)

I really prefer this method.

Less holes in the boat = better.

Many boats in the marina I work at do not have bilge plugs. Mainship, Jefferson, most sailboats etc.

It is my opinion that no winterization is complete with out visual confirmation. Pull a plug, a hose or the like and confirm full winterization. This allows some non-tox into the bilge, plus possible spillage plus enough to get the bilge pump to click on and your good. Dry vac'ing out the rest is a great idea before shrink wrapping (or a proper wrap job) which will keep rain and snow out while batteries are disconnected or removed.

Some boats have been fitted with check valves in the bilge pump discharge lines and require this type of winterization or they will freeze and burst. Our Albins were not fitted with these from the factory as far as I know but something to share with your neighbors with big SeaRays, they all have check valves.

Anyway, this is the route I go. My 27 also does not have a bilge drain.

[RobS]

The key to success with non-tox is to eliminate dilution. When I started using a refractometer years back I was quite surprised how any amount of dilution significantly raised the freeze/slush point of the product.

[TorreyWP]

Well said Rob, I believe I got mine on Amazon for under 100 bucks.

It really does not take much water to have -50 non tox burst at 0 or worse.

[jleonard]

I always use a little regular old "prestone" style antifreeze in the bilge. Yea I know, but make that sacrifice to keep my boat intact.