Anyone Using a Force 10 Cabin Heater?

[stxray]

I just picked up a Force 10 diesel-fired, cabin heater at a garage sale. I wasn't really looking for one but it was too cheap to pass up

Now the fun part - Installation

I'm thinking I'll install it against the bulkhead ahead of the closet. I'll probably install a piece of stainless steel on the bulkhead behind it to deflect the heat and protect the wood. It uses a 1" exhaust tube so a small hole on the cabin roof seems necessary.

Anyone using one of these or something similar? Any pictures, installation advice or suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks,
Ray

[Jay Knoll]

Hi Ray

We had a propane version of this model (I'm assuming this is the one you bought? http://www.go2marine.com/docs/8/3/1/0/83101F-mi.shtml) on our Crealock 37 sailboat. It was very effective although we had to run a hella fan near it to prevent stratification in the cabin. We had stainless backing board on the bulkhead but also ended up cutting a small piece of stainless and sticking it inside the unit to shield the cabin side from the burner's heat. There was a good 12" between the side of the stove and the bulkhead but the radiant heat from the stove's burner still made the cabin side unacceptably hot.

I'm having trouble picturing where you are thinking of installing it, do you mean that half bulkhead to the left of the head door?

If that is the place you're thinking I see several potential problems

It will be very easy to bump into the stove (especially when working in the galley) and it gets VERY HOT

The exhaust tube will have to be shielded so you don't accidentally grab it it while moving around the boat

There may not be enough swing room for the head door to open up.

You may bump into it while working in the galley

You might consider putting it on the main bulkhead as far outboard as possible on the starboard side (but not underneath the side deck.) And a fan to circulate the air thoughout the cabin would be a plus.

If you can find a safe place to install it I'm sure that you're going to love it. We used ours a lot during the spring and fall on the Chesapeake , and on our trips up and down the ICW in the fall

Jay

[WillieC]

These miserable winter days sure make a heater seem like a good idea. Like Jay, I wonder where to stick the thing, especially in the A25. Maybe mount it on the OUTSIDE and duct it in. Ha!
I can't pass up good deals either but I am approaching the accumulation point where I may need to move in the middle of the night and leave it all behind. I have a two-way water heater, maybe mount it next to your Force 10, a stainless exhaust elbow that may not fit under my cover, three engines to mix and match and steal parts from, 4 or 5 starters I lose count and used gaskets from two or three rebuilds ago by POs. Enough, already!
But a warm cabin? Nice!

[Jay Knoll]

opps sorry, I was thinking about my FC27 when I was discussing the layout, don't have a clue about the 25 having never been on one.

[stxray]

These miserable winter days sure make a heater seem like a good idea. Like Jay, I wonder where to stick the thing, especially in the A25. Maybe mount it on the OUTSIDE and duct it in. Ha!
I can't pass up good deals either but I am approaching the accumulation point where I may need to move in the middle of the night and leave it all behind. I have a two-way water heater, maybe mount it next to your Force 10, a stainless exhaust elbow that may not fit under my cover, three engines to mix and match and steal parts from, 4 or 5 starters I lose count and used gaskets from two or three rebuilds ago by POs. Enough, already!
But a warm cabin? Nice!

What if you were to pickup another A25 and fasten the two of them together, catamaran-style? If you were to space them far enough apart, you'd have room for all kinds of stuff. However, finding dock space could be problematic.

Sounds like a great idea to me...or, maybe it's the acetone

[WillieC]

If you like acetone, try starting a rebuilt diesel that don't wanna start with unseated rings in a shop with the wind blowing back in on you. Acetone? Pfftt!

[tego]

Ray, That's a great little heater you found. I'm also a 27FC guy but I used one like yours on my Pearson 424 for 13 years of living aboard. We'd turn it on in the fall and shut it down in the spring while we were in Mass. for three years and on the Chesapeake for 3 years. A note of caution, when you install the ss plate to protect your wood, use some small 1/4" spacers behind the ss plate to allow air to circulate behind it. Your wood will get warm but not enough to cause any problems. Make sure you mount it where nobody can stumble against it and put a shield over the flue pipe so nobody can grab it accidentally. We never had a problem with ours, but I did both of the above. Ben

[DesertAlbin736]

For A27 guys this is what the forward cabin on the A25 looks like. The bulkhead Ray is talking about is at right in this picture. The hanging locker closet is visible to the right (starboard side) in this photo. Behind that is the enclosed head. So really, options for heater placement are limited in the A25. At the very least it takes up some of the seating space on the starboard settee, and as it is seating is limited.

So Ray, are you talking about mounting above the shelf over the closet or on the front wall of the closet? The shelf would seem like a better option if there's room for it. I can see why the propane version might be more desirable, since the diesel burners remind me of those on the old pressurized alcohol "curtain burner" galley stoves. That whole thing about pre-heating the burners (hint, gelled alcohol works better as a priming fuel than using liquid alcohol) gives me the willies. We had one of those old pressurized galley stoves on the first sailboat I bought in 1998, which was a 1980 Windrose 25, and if you didn't pre-heat the burners sufficiently to vaporize the fuel they would tend to flare up, hence the nickname "curtain burners". Don't know how a diesel heater reacts, but at best would guess you'd end up with a smokey, stinky cabin.

Albin wardrobe.jpg

What we use for heat, which in our case being in the desert Southwest is not very often, is to use a small electric heater when plugged to shore power at the dock, or an Origo 5000 Heat Pal non pressurized alcohol heater (same principle of operation as the Origo galley stoves) when at anchor. With this we just set it on the cabin floor, and the 5000 BTU warms the cabin in a matter of minutes, and then set it out in the cockpit & with the canvas enclosure zipped up can warm the cockpit too. What I do for storing the alcohol fuel for both the Origo galley stove and the Heat Pal is keep a 1 qt "ready bottle" of fuel in an MSR back packer's fuel bottle, and refill that from a 1 gallon can as needed.

MSR fuel bottle.jpg

Here's a Practical Sailor write up on these. You can find used ones on Ebay fairly reasonable.

http://www.practical-sailor.com/issues/ ... 894-1.html

Origo Heat Pal.JPG

By the way Ray, you know I'm an old Barnegat native, having moved away from NJ 50 years ago this year to Upstate NY in the late 1960s & now in my 40th year of living in AZ. We're planning a big 8,000 mile road trip by car after Labor Day this year, circumnavigating the country visiting friends & relatives from Colorado to Maine to Florida and Mississippi, with hopefully a stop to see my half-brother in Manahawkin and another half-brother in Ft. Pierce, FL maybe even take the Cape May ferry over to Delaware on the way South to Florida before returning to AZ via I-10. Would be fun to drop by on the way through & see your boat & compare notes.

[Jay Knoll]

those may work well in the dry AZ climate but we used one years ago on our Tartan 27 on the Chesapeake and even with ports open (yeah that really helped the boat warm up!) we had lots of moisture inside the boat. I my experience a vented heater is much preferred

[DesertAlbin736]

If money were no object ($2,500 ouch!) a Wallas combo diesel galley stove/cabin heater might be the way to go. Draws combustion air in from outside & exhausts overboard for heat plus flameless cooking that solves the space issue & doesn't add moisture to the cabin. A friend of ours has one on a C-Dory 25 & they work great. But you know, the C-Dory 25 is a $70K to $90K boat, not a poor man's trawler like the A25.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XgrcYmQ0cRA

http://www.wallas.fi/index.php?id=61

I looked up the price on these, and they're a bit more than I'm ready to spend since our current setup works for us. But they should fit & work OK in the A25 galley & can run off the main diesel fuel tank if one can afford it. They do however use some electricity, 0.55 to 0.85 Amps @12VDC, and apparently are somewhat sensitive to low voltage.

[stxray]

A note of caution, when you install the ss plate to protect your wood, use some small 1/4" spacers behind the ss plate to allow air to circulate behind it. Your wood will get warm but not enough to cause any problems. Make sure you mount it where nobody can stumble against it and put a shield over the flue pipe so nobody can grab it accidentally. We never had a problem with ours, but I did both of the above. Ben

Ben, Great point. Thanks.

[stxray]

...So Ray, are you talking about mounting above the shelf over the closet or on the front wall of the closet? The shelf would seem like a better option if there's room for it.

I don't think there is enough room to place it on the shelf. It would be way to high and way too close to the cabin roof/ceiling.

What we use for heat, ...

Not a bad idea but I already bought this thing.

By the way Ray, you know I'm an old Barnegat native, having moved away from NJ 50 years ago this year to Upstate NY in the late 1960s & now in my 40th year of living in AZ. We're planning a big 8,000 mile road trip by car after Labor Day this year, circumnavigating the country visiting friends & relatives from Colorado to Maine to Florida and Mississippi, with hopefully a stop to see my half-brother in Manahawkin and another half-brother in Ft. Pierce, FL maybe even take the Cape May ferry over to Delaware on the way South to Florida before returning to AZ via I-10. Would be fun to drop by on the way through & see your boat & compare notes.

Absolutely! Let me know your plans and we'll put something together.

[stxray]

If money were no object ($2,500 ouch!) a Wallas combo diesel galley stove/cabin heater might be the way to go.

Nice but way out of my budget.

[DesertAlbin736]

Nice but way out of my budget.

Same here. That's why I don't have one either. Will keep you posted on our travel plans, but as of this writing likely to be passing through NJ sometime in mid-September.

[stxray]

Nice but way out of my budget.

Same here. That's why I don't have one either. Will keep you posted on our travel plans, but as of this writing likely to be passing through NJ sometime in mid-September.

Great! I may even be in the water by then. PM me with the specifics as it gets closer. I'd love an opportunity to compare notes and pick your brain (relative to the A25, )