Disappointing survey today, Albin 28TE

[Norseman]

Not only was there a bunch of little stuff, like rusted out pumps, single hoseclamps below the waterline, non-functioning equipment, but also de-lamination on a 3 foot section below the waterline and water intrusion inside the hull above, and also only 18 knots at max throttle 3390 RPM.
(5 guys onboard, half fuel, clean bottom)
Engine box, Yanmar 315, boat 2002, motor 2006, 500 hours.
Boat looked clean on initial inspection, but it only indicated the owner is good at washing boats, not maintaining
Boats .
$711 down the drain for survey and haul.

[jcollins]

$711 down the drain for survey and haul.

Don't be discouraged. IMHO it's money well spent. Is the owner interested in reducing the price accordingly? Or, are you not interested in a fixer-upper?

[Jeremyvmd]

Was this on Amber j? Little scary about the delam. That would be a dealbreaker for me:/. Sorry to hear it turned out poorly for u

[Norseman]

Not Amber J.
She had other problems but overall a better boat.
(Or I had a better surveyor today)

Not sure what will happen with this one, I may make a severely reduced offer, or I may walk away.
Not looking for a project boat however, rather a well maintained and well equipped used Albin 28.

2 out of 2 Albins I have surveyed this year in Florida have had lazy owners.
Really, if you are selling your boat, fix what is wrong with it first, then you get a better price and a faster sale.

[Jeremyvmd]

There's good boats out there. if your not looking for a project might wanna walk away. You'll never be happy with it if your starting in a hole

[TimQ]

It is discouraging for sure, but hang in there. There were a lot of 28's built so there's regular turnover. You'll find the right one.

We went through disappointments while searching also and eventually found the right boat. She was well worth waiting for.

[Norseman]

Yeah, will hang in there, no rush.
It is like looking for a girl friend, can be hard to find the right one on demand.
Once you stop looking, they are all over the place:)

Found this one on the 'net: http://www.yachtworld.com/boats/2003/Albin-28-Tournament-Express-2877944/Stuart/FL/United-States#.ViuIXZT3arU

May go and see it, or I just may step away from the plate and do nothing for a while.

[jleonard]

Well now that you have been thru a couple of surveys you can do your own pre survey and hopefully eliminate those that can't pass muster before you pay again.

[Norseman]

Yeah true, except they were both engine related, need to take the bot out for a spin to check for rated performance before the survey/sea trial. The last boat had de-lamination below the water line and wet core above the water line in the 2 aft corners.
Nothing a pre-isurvey inspection would reveal.
The solution of course would be that owners maintain their boats, or at least declare problems in the advertisement so Buyers don't waste a bunch of time and money on surveys to find hidden and costly defects.(

[RobS]

...
Nothing a pre-survey inspection would reveal.

That depends on who it is that's looking. For over a year my phenolic hammer and Skipper Plus moisture meter lived in my car. Do some research and get some gadgets, they will pay for themselves.

And you should be able to get a sea trial once your accepted offer and deposit is in place prior to engaging a surveyor. This way you can check performance.

When some crappy boats are advertised as being in great condition it's actually not false advertising because the owners lack the actual knowledge (a.k.a being stupid) to know the problems that lie within.. I've been told more than once by sellers "You know more about my boat in an hour that I do in years of ownership." Not a good sign!

[Norseman]

Sure, I could do a do-it-myself survey if Indeed I had planned on, or had known I would have to
kiss a few frogs before I found a princess.
I will certainly bring a toolkit before I go and look at a boat next time
I asked about these cored hulls before and several people said there is no problems.
(On this forum)
Yesterday during the bum survey, 3-4 problems were found, de-lamination, water intrusion, chipped/
Cracked fiberglass with water dripping out and more.
The boat was hauled and painted June this year so the problems should have been discovered, but possible just brushed under the carpet, "because I will sell it shortly anyway".
(Speculating here, perhaps just pure ignorance, but still a waste of time and money for buyers thinking they are
Getting a "Well maintained boat" when In reality it is something else)

Will get the full report in a few days, then I will make the final decision, but already putting my running shoes on.

[RobS]

...only 18 knots at max throttle 3390 RPM.
(5 guys onboard, half fuel, clean bottom)
Engine box, Yanmar 315, boat 2002, motor 2006, 500 hours.
.

Did she blow black smoke? I imagine you did not get into it enough to measure boost or check linkages, no load rpm, photo-tach, fuel filters, etc. I don't think it's a tach issue as you did not get the rpms or the speed.

Did the owner say that the low performance specs were a new condition or something that just started, or was he just the typical owner in denial that his boat was simply perfect.. She needs to see 3,900+ WOT with that load.

[Norseman]

No black smoke.
Everything looked and sounded normal, except for RPM and speed.
(Except the engine was hard to start in the morning, it took several tries to get it going, battery was good)
Is the target max speed mph OR Knots? 24 max speed for the Yanmar "engine box" model?
I thought perhaps a throttle or linkage problem could have caused the less than stellar performance.
If the owner is smart he digs into it, corrects the problem and invites the buyer and surveyor back
For another sea trial.

Did not get into troubleshooting, only observations.
The owner seemed in denial.

[RobS]

If you were getting the speed and not the rpm I would suspect the tach but not the case here. A 2002 should have the Beade gauges which are actually fairly accurate. The earlier Yanmar models had the grey plastic yanmar factory modular gauge cluster which included a non adjustable and inaccurate tach and metric gauges.

She should hit low to mid 20's speed depending on current and knts/mph setting on gps.

A hard starting Yanmar, that is NEVER normal. Nothing fires quicker than a Yanmar. Could have an air leak in the fuel supply (among other things)..

[Norseman]

Got neither the speed, nor the RPM, could be a number of things...
Yeah hard starting, never had a Yanmar before. Not a good sign..?
Dirty filters, air leaks, whatever, the owner should have paid attention to that before he
put it up for sale.
That and the delaminated hull.

Don't have the factory specs in front of me, but the boat was rated and tested at a max speed?
Does anybody remember the number and was it mph or knots?

Looks like the timing belt change was overdue by 3 years.
How much to have a Yanmar shop replace it?