Bilge pumps

[Denis]

Funny story from yesterday.
Yesterday I was down at the marina working on my boat, it was very cold by the way, not spring-like at all, when a fellow came up to me and started asking questions about my Albin. More specifically about the bilge pumps and how they are wired. It turned out that he was a marine mechanic with 25 + years working on boats and he could not figure out the bilge pump wiring on an Albin he maintains for a customer.
Two years ago when I got my Albin I was checking out the bilge pumps and could not for the life of me determine what the three dash switches were all about and he was having the same trouble on a newer Albin he was working on. He had called Albin and talked with someone, he said they were no help at all, no wiring diagram, no idea what the third bilge pump switch might go to. He and I both tried to follow the wires but to no avail. I told him I eventually ended up re-wiriing all the bilge pumps so that I now know what the switches actually do and where they go. He was going to continue to try and follow the wires and try to figure it out. It's so strange that a company like Albin, that builds such a fine boat is completly in the dark about several of their own designs and is so lax about details like wiring diagrams and the need to let customers know how the systems on their boats operate, even for safety stuff like bilge pumps. It was somwhat reassuring to know that an experienced mechanic was having the same trouble I was having a couple of years ago.

[Double Lucky]

Denis, now you've got me thinking. My assumption is that the three switches for the bilge pumps are: 1. power to both 2. direct power fwd BP 3. Direct power aft BP.

I have used these switches as above and believe that the switches work as above. For example I put # 1 in the off position when cleaning the bilge and neither of the BPs operate with their automatic float switch even with high water level in the bilge.

Also, I operate switches # 2 and/or # 3 independently to pump water that is below the level that is necessary to turn on automatically with the float switch.

I always leave # 1 on when I am away from the boat.

Turning the aft BP on manually with swithch # 3 when under way (bow up) is very effective in removing the last drop of water from the bilge. Even fwd bilge is dry after this.

Denis, how is this set-up different from yours? I like the set up but I will check it again when I next get to the boat.

Russ

[RicM]

I believe I have the wiring diagram for the bilge pump in my package at home. I will check and if so, scan and post.

[Denis]

I do not have an aft pump. I have two diaphram pumps on the starboard side. One has a hose running down under the engine, the other has a hose running up to pick up the shower water. I also have a pump with a float switch in the cockpit under the carpet. How it operated on my 94 and apparently on the 98 he was working on, the third pump switch seemed to do nothing at all. It is fully wired and the light comes on but I can't trace the wires once they get into the bundles. I don't want to cut all the wire ties to see where they go, but I am fairly sure I do not have an aft pump and I have had my head under the engine as far as I can and I dont' even see a float switch under the engine. Maybe my boat has a pump under the engine that is non functional and I can't see it, who knows.

[mhanna]

You have me thinking now....
My 2001 has 3 momentary dash switches 1)front 2)mid 3)aft
The aft has a float and I am assuming is hot all the time (and will check)
The mid is the diaghpram pump and I dont think there is a float
The front....hmmmm

I am assuming they are momentary to help prevent burning the pumps out, but if I ever needed them, I certainly dont wish to keep 3 fingers on the switches all the time.

I will check and advise...

Matt

[RicM]

I have a diagram that shows 3 bilge pumps, one at the stern, one at the starboard side outboard and just astern of the helm seat (I assume it must have a remote switch and an intake hose leading to a low point in the bilge) and a third under the sole in the cabin, just aft of the shower pump. The diagram shows the route of the wiring harness, but no colors on wires or switches, sorry. You could try a device called a fox & hound. The fox is a little box with aligator clips on it that broadcasts a beeping signal through an open or closed circuit. The hound is another box with a shiffer that allows you to follow wires in a harness or even through a wall. I have found it to be a great help with wiring mysteries.

[Denis]

That sounds cool, I need to get one.

[Richard]

Any idea where to get the tool?

[RicM]

The Fox and Hound is made by Tripplet, http://www.triplett.com/ and can be found at any electronics store with a good telco dept. They are used by cable and telephone installers to chase circuits throuh buildings and in bundles at the phone hookup box. Not cheap, about $100, but it's the only way to do the job right. I own a building with 12 offices and in the old days (15 years ago) we had a phone system with about 50 extensions. Every time I had a tenet want to move a phone it cost me $100 so I decided to learn how to do it myself.

If it's a one time thing you could probably hire a cable or home theater installer to trace the circuits for you. How about wire colors? The factory is supposed to use certain colored wire for certain uses....I believe bilge pump is brown... see http://www.brokeboats.com/biacolors.html. You could also just call Albin and ask....

[RicM]

Also, sounds like a great topic for the NE Rendezvous, there are going to be some Albin tech people there no? Someone might suggest it to Andrew over on that thread... a little seminar on forensic wiring...