A27 Aft Cabin Grab Rails

[Jay Knoll]

Hi Everyone

I'm planning on removing the grab rails and installing new ones (easier to varnish in the shop). Does anyone know how the grab rails are attached to the cabin top? I think I read somewhere that there are nuts embedded in the cabin top, but I can't find that reference.

The overhead is in great shape so I don't want to pull it down and I thought I'd see if anyone had any experience in this area before I start tearing things apart. Hopefully I can do everything from the topsides.

The grab rails on the fore deck are attached by screws/bolts from inside the cabin, the heads are clearly visible -- I'm planning on a better backing system when I get to that project.

Thanks for the assistance!

Jay

[don123]

My previous owner replaced all the handrails with the poly 'fake teak' ones, which was a HUGE mistake. After a few years of heating/cooling, every single one of them is broken and in many places - Between the loops as well as around the screws. If you're seriously considering doing all the work necessary to replace them, don't use the fake stuff. If your old ones are still in decent shape, refinishing them on the boat would be much less work than replacing them

They are installed with long screws from inside the cabin, up through the cabin top and into the grab rail - No nuts or bolts. Replacing them requires removing the headliner and he did a wonderful job installing the new headliner, but now it all must come down to get the screws out

I'm extending my roofline aft to cover the aft cabin, so most of my new handrails will be on top of that and I'm just going to fill in the holes where the old ones used to be. My only remaining wooden ones will be the pair on the forward cabin top

Don

[Jay Knoll]

Don

Thanks, I dodged the fake teak bullet. The handrails on the aft cabin have plugs in them so i think the fasteners are going down into the cabin from the outside. I've been down the "refinish in place" route before and I'm not going to do that this time!

I'll keep you posted as I start tearing things apart..

Jay

[sail149]

Hi on my '84ac the hand rails are all bolted from the top and the nut on the bottom that are covered on a fiberglass type putty to try and stop leaks. It made it very hard to get a wrench on it. While removing a handrail I had to break of 3 of the 5 screws as the nuts lock on The machine screw. Ugly. The liner has to be removed.
My plan is to use a SS tee nut on the underside so I can remove and or tighten the screws when it's needed.
I also plan to counterbore the underside of the rail and fit a silicone O-ring instead of mastic or worse silicone.
I'm disappointed to hear about the failure of the fake teak hand rails as I has hoped to use white plastic hand rails.
100% virgin plastic like starboard the does hold up very well. Maybe the fake teak was a recycled product?warren

[Jay Knoll]

Hi Warren

Sorry I missed your post, thanks for that description. Hopefully I'll be able to get the bolt out without breaking anything.

You might want to rethink the O ring plan, it certainly is innovative but I've never seen it used before and it would appear to be a bit "tricky" to get it to seal properly. A sailing friend turned me on to butyl tape for bedding. Here is a link you might find interesting.

http://www.pbase.com/mainecruising/rebedding_hardware

I've got the tape sitting in my shop, haven't used it yet (lots of other projects in the queue)

Lots of other good advice on that site as well.

Jay

[DesertAlbin736]

It would think varnishing them while still attached to the boat would be much easier as long as the wood is still in good shape. In fact, I just got done doing exactly that. If old varnish needs to be stripped off, the way to do it without using harsh chemicals is to carefully use a mechanic's electric heat gun (like a hair dryer on steroids) and a paint scraper. The heat gun will soften the old varnish to where it comes off easy with a scraper. Just be careful not to scorch the wood. Then just mask them off, sand, and varnish in the normal way. Here's my results.

[sail149]

Hi
They look nice
Problem with the a27 handrails is they are not tight so leak.
You cannot tighten the bolts as they break off, in fact I had to break them to be able to remove the handrail.
See earlier post on why.
So stuck with remounting after fixing old rails or putting new rails on I think new wood or plastic is the way to go after all the effort to remove as getting behind the cabin liner is really ugly.
Warren

[JT48348]

They are indeed bolted from the top down through the deck and into nuts embedded in fiberglass. There are no backing plates or suitable fender washers.

I had to grind off the fiberglass and nuts off at which point the handrail will come out of the deck. Then you can drill out the teak plugs. They are only 3/16-14" deep and will collapse on themselves as you drill them out. Remove the bolts. Replace with new bolts bolted from the top down into the deck and then either a backing plate or fender washer with nylock nut.

You can get new plugs or better yet make your own with a plug cutter bit.

I recommend cleaning and bright work once removed from boat. It's the only way to do it right and you solve 10 potential problems at once. I also recommend Cerol teak gloss over varnish. It's easy touch up and lasts a very long time.

[Sprig1]

Thanks Jay for asking the right question that's what I was trying to figure out in my post. It seems I can not use the search engine never seem to ask the right question. Thanks again

[sail149]

JT
I assume you don't mean to use Cetol? My boat had that and with the usual lack of maintenance before
I got it , so the Cetol partly pealed off and left razor blade edges everywhere. Then where it stuck it was impossible to remove without serious sanding......
Jay, Re the o-rings, a simple counterbore in the rail wood , plastic or what ever, 1/8" silicone o-ring from hydraulics fittings
Even add some butyl tape if I want for belt and braces, and this is not the same as crappy RTV silicone in a tube.

Come to think of it why are boats the only places nobody uses proper gaskets under fittings to seal out water? With all the flex we put on our fittings there needs to be something better. The fiberglass is too flexible to rely on a thin film of goo.
All I have to do is get around to it!