Inaccessible bilge water amidships.

[Lenovo]

Good evening folks,

There are three working bilge pumps in the bilge of my ET, however there remains standing water beneath the water tank and holding tank which none of the three pumps is positioned to remove and appears difficult to access. Has anyone addressed this issue? Recommendations are welcomed.

Thanks,

Tony

Salty Dog
2001 Express Trawler

[marko]

I've had the same issue and thought there might be an offset in the keel bilge which blocks some water flow all the way back to the accessible lowest point aft. I've had water in same spot that you describe, but it had been dry for some time. That is until last week when I forgot to turn on the shower sump when the little lady went in for a shower and I went ashore to shower. I was able to clean up most thru the center access under the middle berth. I used paper towel rolls (still rolled up) and a long gripper to mop it up and bag it. The center bilge pump did go off once, but as you said, water just stayed there under the tanks. Can't say if bow rise while underway would drain it further aft, but the aft bilge pump is actually higher, next to the transom. Have considered a fourth bilge pump or moving the aft one to the lowest point in the keel bilge, aft. When the boat was pulled this past spring, I noticed an exterior keel bilge drain plug which appears to be about where the center water accumulates as described. The definitive answer would be to scope it but I can't do that.

[Lenovo]

Marko,
Thanks for the response and the recommendation. Will give it a shot this weekend.
Tony

[marko]

Tony:
I did a head stand yesterday in the center bilge access under the midberth and did not see any offset. I could see the manual bilge pickup hose and the center bilge pump. Some water was still there, but it interestingly doesn't flow to the low point in the aft keel bilge.
Mark

[AK_Albin36]

I'm been sneaking up on this project for about a year, maybe this thread will push me over the edge. The wall just behind the low spot is a water-tight bulkhead. The only reason a designer would have placed the mid-bilge pump where he did... accessibility. I've been successful manually pumping it with a 4' long hand pump thus far. The project I have in mind is to install an electric bilge pump to run on a manual 12v switch. Access has prevented me from undertaking the task so far, and a pending decision on where to route the discharge hose. and of course other higher priority fix-it jobs. For now the long-reach manual pump has been working okay the 2-3 times per season that I find water there. Other ideas?

[marko]

I've been studying photos taken where it's difficult to see and impossible to get to. I have an explanation for the center keel water not flowing fully to aft. There is an apparent short plywood barrier (baffle), the ht of the keel only, located directly under the holding tank, per photo. This is not visible from above thru the center interior cabin hatch. The aft bulkhead however, is accessible and is under the aft cabin wall. It does not go down into the keel and does not make a water tight seal, as this is where the fuel lines run from the saddle tanks to the center fuel tank in the engine hold. The saddle tanks are fully forward of the aft bulkhead and the center fuel tank is fully aft of the bulkhead. I understand this varies in the ET's due to engine configurations and maybe just changed over time.

This makes sense in that the center bilge pump is at a low point made by this plywood barrier and, I can't tell for sure, but maybe also the point where there is the exterior keel drain plug. So, I've got two electric bilge pumps and one manual pump pick up in the forward 2/3 rds of the keel and none in the aft 1/3 rd (and deepest and lowest pt) of the keel. That's where I'm also considering placing a new, 4th, bilge pump. The third existing bilge pump is higher, aft of where the keel ends and at the transom.
For reference: 2001 36ET, twin Cummins.

[AK_Albin36]

Thanks for the picture. My single 2004 is a bit different on that aft bulkhead, probably due to the different position of the center tank. I can get to this one from the access immediately forward of the cabin door. For me, the inaccessible one is directly forward of this space, under the mid-berth.

Related bilge maintenance question... does anyone else have an extremely rough surface finish between the hull and the longitudinals? I do and tend to get water/gunk that hangs up in the high side - especially up forward under the mid-berth (port) and hot water heater/head (stbd). I'm thinking of cleaning them good and pouring/painting in epoxy bilge paint to fill in the gaps and smooth the area out, so water and dirt will not collect. Anyone else have this issue? Any other solutions?

[marko]

The barrier seen in the photo above is under the holding tank and does in fact create an offset in the keel bilge as per my original assumption. The aft portion of the keel bilge is about 6 inches higher than the low point just forward, at the mid bilge pump. From looking at haul out photos, it is possible that there is a void or solid area (foam?) in the aft most part of the keel, as it transitions up, just in front of the struts. Also, yes, the interior hull surfaces are fairly rough, dirty and dusty. I've cleaned a few sections forward with Spray 9, but it's slow going, in tight quarters and not fun.

[marko]

I have a new theory as to why there is no bilge pump in the low, aft keel section and will not now install a fourth automatic pump there as per my earlier thinking. Is it possible that it was designed and built that way to keep any potential fuel leaks from getting to one of the three automatic pumps for the twin engine layout of ET's ? The valves, fittings and fuel lines all run in or over this separate bilge area which slopes down to just behind the center tank, thus easily inspected and any minor - modest fuel leaks could be discovered before a potential big problem. This part of the keel bilge is specifically separated from and has a slope aft as per my earlier posts. Also have noticed, at least on the port side bilge, that there are no limber holes in the stringers and no low openings, so if a saddle tank developed a leak, it would be partially contained and hopefully discovered by smell or inspection. Can't see all of the starboard side under that saddle tank, but will investigate more. I understand that the fuel tank configurations vary from year to year and of course with single engine layouts. Hum...too much design credit, just a sequence of fabrication, other keel structure issues or maybe just too much over thinking?