CO Detectors (Household vs Marine Rated)

[SpaceCoaster]

Does anyone know the primary differences between marine-rated and household rated Carbon Monoxide detectors? The ones rated for marine use are much pricier. What does one get for the extra $'s?

Jorge

[jcollins]

Interesting topic. I was getting ready to purchase them. I'll follow this thread.

Thanks,

John

[chiefrcd]

Not sure of the difference between "Marine" vs "Hometype" except the electronics are probably sealed or weather protected more in the Marine type. I found several references to corrosion coating/protection. Here is some good starter information. I will do some more research and see what I can find.

I will add that smoke detectors have saved more lives than all the firefighters in the US, the same safty principle applies to CO detectors, that of early warning. The real problems with CO is that it is colorless, odorless and tasteless. Even though we think we can smell it, you're just smelling other by products of combustion. True CO cannot be detected by humans. So, that's why so many families are wiped out by faulty gas appliances such as hot water heaters and furnances.

The other thing is that CO collects and stays in the body for a long period of time....even though you get fresh air, it's there hanging onto your hemoglobin......then you go back into the CO and it's cummlitave....adds up in your system.

http://www.boatus.org/onlinecourse/cour ... oxide.html

[Mariner]

Not sure of the difference. I'm sure it's either more corrosion resistant internals, or just pure marketing. I Know marine CO detectors are designed to be installed flush in to the bulkhead, while a home one is just a screw into the wall type of deal. A marine/rv unit is designed to be powered by a 12VDC source, while a home unit runs on 120VAC or batteries, or sometimes both.

CO is a legitimate killer. A group of hunters was recently killed here when a leak in their propane heating sytem's exhaust filled their camper trailer with CO.

[SpaceCoaster]

Yes, it is dangerous. Call me paranoid, but after the hurricane season we had here in FL a couple of years ago we had a lot of uninformed people here running generators in their garages and other enclosed spaces. There were numerous reports of entire families being zapped by the stuff... sad.

Also consider that even if you don't have any CO producing equipment running on your boat, a neighboring vessel could have something emitting that a breeze can carry to your cabin.

As far as household vs marine-rated: I figured that running on 12VDC and additional conformal coating are the main differences as you guys have confirmed; but didn't think it that would bump up the price on one so much. I've purchased CO detectors for my house for as low as $19 while the marine-rated ones are around $100. Maybe there are differences in the sensor technology but doubt it.

I'd probably still get the marine rated one for the peace of mind. Plus the fact that can operate off of the 12vdc is a factor. I'd hate to have one onboard and then never be able to find out that when I needed it most the 9V battery was dead or low.

On a similar topic... (maybe should be a different post?) I want to replace our galley stove (alcohol) with a propane or LPG stove. If I replace with a propane or LPG then I assume there's a CO threat. Is this true? So I take it an alcohol stove does not emit CO. ?? I would guess that Albin (or any manufacturer for that mattter) would place all kinds of warnings about CO hazard in their cabin if that was the case.

Jorge

[Mariner]

Just about any kind of combustion produces CO. The reason a specific boat may not have a detector would likely just be because it's not mandated by the AYC or NMMA (both voluntary standards). Our 2003 Albin has a propane stove, but I do not believe it has a CO detector. No other boat we've ever owned had one. I know propane exhaust contains CO, but so does engine exhaust. Theoretically, all cars, boats, busses, RV's , and houses ought to have CO detectors. The reality is that while CO poisoning deaths are a real posibility, they're still actually quite rare. Also, CO detectors are expensive, so few people bother.

Personally, I think common sense is the key. If you use propane heat, the risk is the highest, simply becuase the propane burns so efficiently that there is rarely any other contaminants in the exhaust other than the odorless CO. Thus, it can go unnoticed. This is only a significant threat if a leak develops in the exhaust and vents it into the confined living space. If engine exhaust is filling the cabin, you'll probably notice it and open a hatch (or window). People rarely run a propane stove long enough to produce enough CO to be poisonous. CO poisoning deaths usually happen while the victim is sleeping. So, I don't know that a CO detector is necessary simply because you installed a propane stove, but it may still be a good idea. More imporatant, would be an LP gas detector. Yes, propane has fragrance added so you can smell it, but what if a leak develops while you're not aboard, or while outside the cabin and you don't smell it until it's too late?

[DougSea]

I always try to stay off the pulpit but...

CO is a known killer. CO detectors are 'relatively' inexpensive. My boat will have one after the winter refit (didn't come with one). It just makes sense.

The fear I have is that someone would be sleeping below and whether by the 'station wagon effect' or by a boat moored nearby with an engine or generator running near an open port CO builds up in the cabin...just too horrible to think of.

To Mariner's point, yes, you could argue that a car or any motor vehicle should have one...perhaps one day they will. I recall a story of a guy waiting outside his friend's house on a cold day with his heater on, taxi idling in front of him. Died of CO poisoning from the taxi!

(And I'd have the propane detector too!)

[chiefrcd]

ALL fuels containing carbon ( petrol,diesel, wood, coal, LPG, CNG etc.) product carbon monoxide when they burn......and......

again, like smoke detectors, CO detectors are cheap insurnace for the safety of you and your family. There should never been any debate regarding if they are a good thing or not. Trust me on this one. They are a GOOD thing. Mariner brought up a good point as well....LPG detectors. UNlike CNG but just like gasoline vapors, LPG vapors are two and a half times heaver than air. That means that will will actually "spill" to the lowest area of the boat and accumilate until they reach their explosive range, which in the case of LPG is very wide. Then all they need is a outside source of ignition and they will burn explosively. LPG stoves with small hand size tanks may not pose much of a problem, but if you install a larger LPG tank there are standards that require that they been in a sealed locker that drains overboard. In addition there are some pretty strict standards on the piping/hoses that you use and how they are connected. LPG installation is not for the amature, non-trained sailor ( or home owner). And lastly, gasoline vapors need to be considered. Again, 2.5 times heaver than air, seeking low areas and accumilating...just waiting for a source of ignition. Even though their explosive ranges are more narrow than LPG, once there, the explosion is devistating, usually with total destruction of the boat. There are detectors on the market that will detect a wide range of flammable products, some may be costly but again if you have a problem they offer early detection....
Commen sense and some basic education on flammable gases and liquids goes a long way in helping you understand what hazards exist using these products or appliance that use them. After 40 years in the profession, I'm still amazed when I see people dispensing gasoline into glass containers, plastic milk jugs or using Jerry cans to fill a boat, gasoline to clean parts and paint brushes. It's like Russian roulette, it's not IF the incident will happen, just WHEN...

[jcollins]

What's wrong with this picture?

[chiefrcd]

He stole your flag?

[Mariner]

The flag. It indicates that the back eddy current of air is pushing the exhaust towards the crew, which is seated in an enclosed area with no ventilation.

Granted, our boat does the same thing, but we don't have the enclosed flybridge.

[DougSea]

The flag. It indicates that the back eddy current of air is pushing the exhaust towards the crew, which is seated in an enclosed area with no ventilation.

Granted, our boat does the same thing, but we don't have the enclosed flybridge.

Good pickup Mariner. Pretty clear example of the "Station Wagon Effect"

Another argument for a CO detector...

[jcollins]

The flag. It indicates that the back eddy current of air is pushing the exhaust towards the crew, which is seated in an enclosed area with no ventilation.

Granted, our boat does the same thing, but we don't have the enclosed flybridge.

Yup!

[TonyAmalfitano]

Can we get back to the meat of Spacecoaster's question? What is the difference between "HOUSEHOLD" and "MARINE" CO detectors? I shopped around for household 9 volt CO det'ers, couldn't fine any other then 120V w/ 9V backup. So, I broke down and bought the $100 marine type, 2 of then cause I have 2 cabins.
I'm a Police Officer, I bagged a 15 yr old not too long ago, arrested his father. Had a generator running in the basement, the CO was 300 something PPM in the house. Lucky we didn't bag all 6 of them.

[chiefrcd]

I search around and the only difference I could find was the 12 volt and the protective coatings on the electronics. I think the major difference is the price and the word MARINE on it somewhere......it automatically becomes three times the cost of everything else.....