Radar

[Brandy1937]

By Brandy

Like everything else,everyone has their opinion. And too, I have mine but don't know if it is a valid one or not.
My experience has been with what I feel is the best.(And again "my" opinion )
I'm wondering what other"s opinions are. Is it Quality or price that you base your opinon on?
Does the dome antenna have any advantages over the open array ? Or vice versa ?
What brand do you feel is the best?
Comments??????????/
Thanks
Brandy

[RicM]

Ill rise to that bait. Like everything else in life, the more money you spend, the better performance you get, or perhaps a better seat for the performance, in which case you get to see a little better, (huh?). Do some research. Go to the nearest commercial fishing port near you when there's a good chance that the majority of the boats will be in port. Look at the tops of the boats that look like they have caught the most fish. Chances are you will see Furuno on about 2/3ds of the boats. These guys depend on their radar for their lives and their incomes. They are fishing in the same waters you are traveling in. Odds are they know whereof they speak. Is Furuno the best image? The easiest to use? The best bang for the buck? I don't know, but if all those guys who make their living on the water buy it, there must be reason.

[Brandy1937]

Right on Ricm. That's exactly my train of thought. After being around the commercial fishing industry in the NW and Alaska for many years, that is what I observed.
Also that is what I had on my last boat. I was very pleased with my equipment. I have "always bought the best", especially in safety equipment.
I guess I am just trying make sure I will be doing the right thing.
Not only that, being from the old school, I'm skeptical about having integrated systems. Perhaps new systems are reliable.However,when something goes wrong,I like to have a back up.
Brandy

[joe.baar]

I'm totally sold on the new-generation "Broadband" radars. Among others, see "Passagemaker" magazine June 2009 for a pretty comprehensive review. The Norwegian company Navico, parent of Simrad, Northstar and Lowrance, markets this device and its associated chartplotters through them in this country.

Aside from the incredible resolution these sets provide, there are several other considerations that make them my first choice - although so far I haven't sold my inflatable, motor and SeaWise davit to generate the cash to purchase one. First, price. The Northstar BR24 amplifier array - the thing that resides inside the dome on top of your radar arch - is running about $1,590 and its matching M84 multifunction display - read chartplotter, radar, GPS and depth - is around $1,400. These are retail prices of course, and a careful internet search might find you lower ones. Just be sure you distinguish between "HD", "high definition", and "Broadband", which is an entirely different animal. This is Navico's marketing term for "frequency-modulated continuous-wave (FMCW)" radar. The array doesn't use a magnetron - see below under "safety" - but rather two solid-state amplifiers, one as a transmitter and the other as a receiver.

Second, safety. The BR24 array emits only about a tenth of a watt (!!!), way less than a cell phone. Stand right next to it. Third, ease of installation. Signal processing occurs in the dome so the cabling used is just like the telephone cord inside your house - if you still have a corded phone - consisting of a power wire and a Cat 5 cable.

As far as I can tell from the photos and specs I've seen, only Navico companies are marketing these sets and they all look very much the same. Of course you can choose a larger display screen and up what you pay. Simrad is at the high end for price because it has advanced features like MARPA and chart overlay which the others do not, yet.

[Brandy1937]

By Brandy
Thanks Joe and Susanne for your input. Once in a while there comes a better mouse trap.
I will check it out , however I like to see a track record,since it's new to the market
By the way "Ballard" as in Washington?????????
I've spent a lot of time there years ago.
Regards
Brandy

[joe.baar]

Yes, Ballard Washington, Snoose Junction, unfortunately annexed by the City of Seattle in 1906. Home to the late lamented Phil Harris and the rest of the Deadliest Catch fleet, and site of the Hiram M. Chittenden locks connecting Lake Washington to Puget Sound.

I do agree entirely with you about new product track records, and with Ric M about why Furuno is at the top of the heap. Regarding these issues I need to point out that while the BR24 is relatively new to the civilian market its military version has been used with great success for maybe ten years so I believe the technology is proven; it also has fewer moving or electrified parts than the radars we're used to. Simpler is always better.

Furuno has been a market leader in the commercial and industrial worlds for a long time and will probably remain so. However Furuno has priced its most recent product lines out of my reach. Businesses and government agencies with revenue streams won't have any problem continuing to specify Furuno but I am no longer able to afford what they offer for boaters like myself, much as I'd like all the functionality.

[Brandy1937]

By Brandy

Thanks joe.baar
Brings back fond memories of my working days.
I used to do a lot of work for ( what was called then ) Universal Sea Foods.
Did a lot of work on,before her demise, The Galaxy, as well as some of the other vessels.

Regards
Brandy

[chiefrcd]

I'll throw a pennys worth in cause I'm not sure I have two cents worth of knowledge.
Much has been made about power and resolution. Read up as much as you can about the general knowledge of how radar works. The height off the water for example has a huge impact on how far you can " see ". On a 9' high Albin 28 your distance to target is dramatically shortened verses a radar setting on a 20' high fishing trawler. Also, open array 6 kw radars can pick up birds if tuned properly. 4 kw domes cannot. I have a 4 kw dome, I know. Lots of fisherman that I know use the radar to pick up birds who are working the fish. So open array with a minimum of 6kw works for them. Higher up sees farther, angle of the boat while running can also have a impact vs. setting still so you need to take that into consideration. As far as Brand, I use a Raytheon C80 and have had it for 5 years. I've upgraded the software once and have had no trouble at all. It is a life saver in heavy fog or while traveling a night. Ok...that's a pennys worth....all I have.

[Mariner]

In my opinion, brand reputation is less important than integratability. If you already have a suite of Furuno electronics on your boat, by all means, buy a Furuno radar. However, if your chartplotter and other electronics are Raymarine, I would stick with that. Of course, if they won't work together and do things like overlay the radar on the chartplotter or share information, then it really doesn't matter, aside from resale. People buying boats like to see uniformity in the electronics.

[DougSea]

I'm totally sold on the new-generation "Broadband" radars. Among others, see "Passagemaker" magazine June 2009 for a pretty comprehensive review. The Norwegian company Navico, parent of Simrad, Northstar and Lowrance, markets this device and its associated chartplotters through them in this country.

Aside from the incredible resolution these sets provide, there are several other considerations that make them my first choice - although so far I haven't sold my inflatable, motor and SeaWise davit to generate the cash to purchase one. First, price. The Northstar BR24 amplifier array - the thing that resides inside the dome on top of your radar arch - is running about $1,590 and its matching M84 multifunction display - read chartplotter, radar, GPS and depth - is around $1,400. These are retail prices of course, and a careful internet search might find you lower ones. Just be sure you distinguish between "HD", "high definition", and "Broadband", which is an entirely different animal. This is Navico's marketing term for "frequency-modulated continuous-wave (FMCW)" radar. The array doesn't use a magnetron - see below under "safety" - but rather two solid-state amplifiers, one as a transmitter and the other as a receiver.

Second, safety. The BR24 array emits only about a tenth of a watt (!!!), way less than a cell phone. Stand right next to it. Third, ease of installation. Signal processing occurs in the dome so the cabling used is just like the telephone cord inside your house - if you still have a corded phone - consisting of a power wire and a Cat 5 cable.

As far as I can tell from the photos and specs I've seen, only Navico companies are marketing these sets and they all look very much the same. Of course you can choose a larger display screen and up what you pay. Simrad is at the high end for price because it has advanced features like MARPA and chart overlay which the others do not, yet.

Joe,

I have the Northstar BR24 with the M-121 display and so far I'm loving it. I don't have a lot of experience with other radar systems so I can't speak to the pros/cons in comparison but I can tell you that it's a very easy system to install, setup, and use.

I can tell you that friends who have been on the boat are amazed at the level of detail, especially in close. I've kept the boat on a mooring and I can normally pick out the mooring balls all around me. The 121 was certainly not cheap but given all that it has built in all you have to do is add a nice transducer and the radome and you have a great single station setup.

I'd be happy to answer any questions.

(And it does chart overlay right out of the box!)