Albin 25 vs 27FC

[Jay Knoll]

I've followed this thread with interest. I have an acquaintance who owned a 25, he said it was great until he moved to FL and the lack of opening ports was a deal breaker for him. I think our 27 has better air flow than our former Crealock 37! Because you cruise in a cooler climate this may/may not be an issue for you but it is important for us in FL

At some point you're going to have to let your heart take over from your head. Regardless of the pros/cons of each type if you don't smile when you walk down the dock to board your boat you'll never be satisfied with your choice.

PO care is of course an issue, I looked at one 27 that had major leaks and so much interior damage that I wouldn't have taken it if the owner paid me, but I do know that someone else happily paid good money for it.

Good luck with the hunt!

[Hobbit]

I have learned from others experience that I will not use any sort of davits that allow a portion of a tender to extend beyond the sides of my vessel, and I will not tow a tender in rough seas. That means on longer crossings you have to assume its going to get rough.

Dinghy on top.

[Hobbit]

I have learned from others experience that I will not use any sort of davits that allow a portion of a tender to extend beyond the sides of my vessel, and I will not tow a tender in rough seas. That means on longer crossings you have to assume its going to get rough.

Dinghy on top.

[Hobbit]

draw1.jpg

Jay Knoll,

My solution to no opening portlights on my Albin 25.

I designed these when I had my canvas shop. They install over the front hatch and allow you to have it open in pouring rain and wind to 20 knots or so. I actually leave mine on all summer. It includes dorade type protection from spray and insect screen.

[Hobbit]

JT48348,

I saw the 48348 and a thought flashed through my head... not far from my old stomping grounds. We moved from Port Huron area to Washington.

TY Your comments are well taken. I have made a donation but have not yet been knighted a supporting member so I don't have access to any of the documents yet. I am just trying to glean as much as I can from various observations.

I had a Irwin 37 CC that if you looking on sailing forums was badly disparaged over several issues. Leaking portlights, thin hulls on some years, etc. Bottom line, we loved ours. Care and condition makes a world of difference. Knowing weak spots that others have found help identify where to look to see if a particular vessel has that issue.

Interesting about the mast on a 27FC... I know it wasn't designed as a motor sailor but those that have experimented may have some information on how well the concept works. I have seen the one in WI for sail that has a mast. There also is one in MN that if you read all the details of the listing also has a mast. I didn't know if this was an option or something that individuals experimented with. Apparently the latter. Question is... do they help?

You apparently are very happy with your 27FC! That is very good to know. One or two boats with issues are not a trend. Ten people on a forum steering me away from a particular model might be. I haven't seen that here at all.

[JT48348]

FYI. The A27 in Minnesota doesn't have a mast. The yacht broker cut and pasted the equipment listing from the boat in WI which has the hinged mast & staysail listed. Check out the photos

[Jay Knoll]

Great hatch cover idea Thanks for the drawing. Do you leave it on when you're underway?

[Hobbit]

Great hatch cover idea Thanks for the drawing. Do you leave it on when you're underway?

I leave it up just about all the time Jay. I only take it down when I think there is a possibility of taking a wave over the bow, not just spray. It is held on by 8 snaps an upon removing the rear two support rods from their pockets, it folds flat. I just slip it under a v berth cushion.

[Jay Knoll]

What did you use for the support rods? Source?

Thanks

I think the first mate might be revving up her sewing machine in the near future

Jay

[coolchange]

Two things...the comment about getting the best (most upgraded) and repaired is always a smart move...less work and all the goodies come deeply discounted i.e. if I get an anchor winch for $1000 I never expect to increase the value by same and hope for maybe half..but I did add value to my cruising and will get a little back. Our 27 came with so many things I wanted but likely would not have gotten myself. Second: the headroom, for me, is a big deal...I am 6'3 and can move easily at helm and below (with a slight wide stance)

Also, I moved away from an 8'6 beam boat to a 9'6 and the space inside was significantly more comfortable and the handeling in rough seas was much better...like Desert Albin I trailer (2-3 times a year) the 27 is heavier longer and more of a handful on the road..but very doable...if you go this route think carefully about the tow rig and how far you plan to tow ( 6.0 diesel works fine).

[Beta Don]

I think that if you have an A25 and you like it, then moving up to a 27 strictly for those few times when you'll have 5 aboard would probably be a mistake. Hopefully hetek will chime in here at some point - He owned a 27 and downsized to a 25, so his experience would be meaningful

The 27 does have more room - More headroom too if and if you're 6' or more, you would probably appreciate that. IMO, the 27 isn't as well built as the 25's in almost every regard. If taking it down the road is important, trailering a 27 is a much harder proposal - You need a very rugged, heavy duty trailer and a big truck to pull it with. I trailered ours more than 2,000 miles. There are many 27's sitting on trailers, but few of those you would be comfortable trailering any significant distance. The way Desert Albin uses his boat is something you could almost never do with a 27. It's heavy, it's wide (too wide to be legal in some states) it's hard on the trailer you have it on and it's a real bear to pull out of the water, even with a big truck. It's only 2' longer, but it's nearly 2' wider and it weighs at least 50% more. Decked out for cruising, our 27 weighed in at nearly 11,000 pounds - Picture pulling that compared to your 25

I wanted a 27 for a long time before I bought one - I'll admit I fell in love with the lines, the design and the remarkable use of space. I spent a lot of time refurbishing it and re-engineing it. We cruised it for more than 1500 miles last spring and to be honest, I was quite disappointed in the way it handles any sort of sea - It's fine in calm water, in lakes or rivers but if you're going offshore even a few miles I *think* you might wish you had your old 25 back. You don't need more than 2 to 3 foot seas and you've got white water blowing completely over the boat - Make SURE it has good wipers!

One last piece of advice - If you think a 27 might be the improvement you hope it would be, I would advise an extensive sea trial in as similar conditions to how and where you would be using the boat as possible - Take it out when conditions are less than perfect and find out what you like and what you don't. We took ours to the Dry Tortugas, 70 miles west of Key West and had *nearly* ideal conditions both out and back, but it was still a bumpy ride across miles of open ocean. We had several bumpy rides far closer to shore too. One near Panama City, one near Ft Myers and a particularly harrowing one in an unexpected squall near Marathon. The fact that I remember them all clear as a bell should say something

My one regret - I fell in love with the 27 after seeing several of them while I was cruising in my 34' sailboat and I bought one and spent a ton of time and a small fortune on it before I had any experience sailing it - That was a mistake

Don

[WillieC]

Another reason to read EVERYTHING Don has written. Thank you, sir.

[DesertAlbin736]

We took ours to the Dry Tortugas, 70 miles west of Key West

I knew this one guy from my Montgomery sailboat days who sailed a Montgomery 17 out to the Dry Tortugas and Fort Jefferson.

I fell in love with the 27 after seeing several of them while I was cruising in my 34' sailboat and I bought one and spent a ton of time and a small fortune on it before I had any experience sailing it

That's the way one makes a small fortune, start with a large fortune & buy a project boat.

[DesertAlbin736]

There are many 27's sitting on trailers, but few of those you would be comfortable trailering any significant distance. The way Desert Albin uses his boat is something you could almost never do with a 27. It's heavy, it's wide (too wide to be legal in some states) it's hard on the trailer you have it on and it's a real bear to pull out of the water, even with a big truck.

My Dodge Ram 2500 diesel 4x4 could probably handle towing a 27 (and shifting to 4 low on the ramp keeps wheels from spinning), but considering the mountain grades & desert temperatures we have to deal with out West I'd probably would want a 1 ton dually to pull a 27. We've racked up over 12,000 miles towing our Albin, and before that we took our Catalina 25 (8,000 lbs with trailer) out to San Diego and back twice, 1,450 miles in total. Those mountain grades on I-8 from here to San Diego include going from El Centro, CA, which is actually below sea level, climbing over a series of coastal range summits that top out at 4,400 feet and back down to sea level at San Diego over a 115 mile stretch, in summer temperatures that can exceed 115 crossing the desert. It's not just having the power to pull it, but also having the vehicle weight and braking capacity to slow it down, especially coming downhill on 5% and 6% grades that go on for miles. You know it's a steep hill when you see 'runaway truck ramps' along the way. Also having a weight carrying capacity to handle a tongue weight of 10% of the total trailer weight to keep from fishtailing. Even with the 25 I would recommend a 3/4 ton truck for any long distance trailering, especially if dealing with 5% and 6% hill grades.

Speaking of being "hard on the trailer", I'm somewhat anal about keeping track of expenses, and for those 12,000 miles of trailering La Dolce Vita over the past two and a half years I've spent $3,300 on "trailer repairs" for our 1999 aluminum trailer, mostly for tires and brakes, plus various and sundry things like having cracked cross members welded, re-doing the support bunks, hub grease seals, various tools and supplies plus shop labor for on the road breakdown repairs and for some of the things I've farmed out.

[Beta Don]

I had a gooseneck trailer with 10 ply rated tires for my 27 and I never towed it with anything smaller than a 1 ton dually - I set it up to put about 1500 pounds on the hitch. Even with 80 psi in the 10 ply tires, we managed to blow out a tire about 100 miles from home on our way back from Jacksonville. Never had any other trailer issues, but then we only went a couple thousand miles with it . . . . the trailer was made from 4 x 8" steel 'I' beams and it had a pair of 6,000 pound torsion axles, so no springs to worry about. Brakes on all 4 wheels. Once you get above 8,000 pounds or so, towing these things gets interesting. If I was 'trailer sailing' I would definitely pick a 25 over a 27. I towed an O'Day 25 2800 miles from Biloxi to Seattle and back . . . . in my younger days

I've read and followed most all of your travels since you bought your 25. I had originally envisioned using our 27 in that manner - Tow it to the Chesapeake, spend a couple months and tow it back home. Maybe do the same for New York and the Erie Canal like you did, but I came to think the 27 is not a very good long distance road cruiser, no matter how heavy duty your trailer is - I'm afraid breakdowns would be inevitable

Don