Battery Charging Help

[crowra]

Like Rob#3 said, maybe a diagram would be easier to follow. Does my "As Is" look correct? If it does, there are three sources charging the same battery(ies). I left out things like fuses and negative wiring. I didn't notice the brass jumper between 1 and 2 terminal on the charger. That looks correct. You don't need a jumper going to terminal 3 if it is charging a separate battery. And once you get this all figured out and resolved recommend putting covers on any exposed positive terminals.

[Paddy]

Yes, your diagrams appear to be spot on, the only mystery is where the 3rd wire is going. I have 2 "charger gauge red wires" connected to the same terminal bus and two at the charger, but I cannot trace the top one completely at this time, I need to relook. In theory, the top should be going directly to the starter battery, but until I find out where it's going and what it does, I am going to leave it as is and easily wire the echo to charge the starting battery.

You guys are beyond great, thanks for the help.

PS - RobS - I did a search...was the Hella replacement navigational lights a simple R&R or did you have to drill new mounting holes? I love the look, hate the price, but might pull the trigger if its a simple swap out.

Thanks

[RobS]

PS - RobS - I did a search...was the Hella replacement navigational lights a simple R&R or did you have to drill new mounting holes? I love the look, hate the price, but might pull the trigger if its a simple swap out.

Thanks

Simple R&R but yes drill new mounting holes. What made it simple was that the old holes are covered up with the new new light.

[TimQ]

Crowra,
Your suggested rewiring is good, except since he already has the echocharge he should connect it. That will direct some of the alternator output to the start battery while underway.

[crowra]

Tim Q,

Good point (and embarrassing!) -- especially since that's how mine is set up!

Rob

[Paddy]

So I rewired the Echo Charge to have a direct + feed from the house battery and the other directly to the starting battery, so that's done.

The A/C charger is still baffling me. #1 positive feed goes to the positive bus, #2 goes to the ON position of the dedicated switch for the starting battery. The starting battery is definitely not charging off the charger, so something is up. According to Pro Mariner, I should have 14.7V at the DC connections with no feeds connected, and I do. Connected, I drop to 12.6, but the float level should be 13.5V. As per the troubleshooting direction, the manual says to disconnect the DC while leaving the A/C on for a few hours to re-set, so thats my next step.

Will keep you posted.

[crowra]

If #2 goes to the ON position of the switch for the starting battery and that same terminal (ON) is connected to your battery, it should charge the starting battery. Are you checking the voltage directly from the battery with a volt meter? Maybe your gauges are wired incorrectly (although I don't know where it would be reading 12.6 from...).

Do you have a separate battery for your thruster?

I also replaced my incorrect diagram above to show proper wiring of the Echo Charger in case someone else has a similar problem.

[Paddy]

Sorry Rob, I'm not up to speed with how to create diagrams!

The charger mystery is solved. One goes directly to the positive bus, the other goes to the ON side of the starting switch. So the battery cable and charging cable are connected together at the ON side of the switch. With everything hooked up, I read 12.6V at the D/C side of the charger, at the switch and at the starting battery, same with the positive bus. Per the manual, I should read 14.7 in Absorption mode and 13.5 in Float mode. Does float = maintain, meaning the batteries are fully charged but the charger is supplying them with a constant 13.5V?

Per the troubleshooting, it says the charger may need to refresh itself. I need to disconnect the DC side but leave it on for a few hours. Going to give that a try.

Oops, and no, the charger is not charging the starting battery, only the alternator is with the house battery switch set on BOTH.

[Panhdjoe]

Hello, just wanted to mention that a Inverter should NEVER be on line (turned on) with the genset running, as was mentioned in a previos post. AC geting together out of phase can cause major problems. Joe

[Paddy]

Thanks for the input, unfortunately, no generator on the boat, so one less thing to worry about.

Today, I found a ton of info on the Pro Mariner Protech 4 charger. Sounds like the first versions were duds, they did not charge batteries independently, and if one bank is charged, it shuts down. I am going to try a direct shot to the house battery only and see if that works for now. The echo charge and alternator should keep the starting battery healthy.

[RobS]

If the starting battery is truly a starting battery it should need nothing but the alternator just like your car or truck.

[whwells]

The inverter as a charging system works really well. It is an even charging system and never over or undercharges the batteries. Found this to be true on my former Albin 35te as well as the current Sabre.
whwells "Howard"

[TimQ]

Paddy, I suspect your charger feed to the start battery is on the wrong terminal of the battery switch (you state it is in the "on".). If you have a multimeter identify the cable that is connected from the engine battery to the battery switch, or physically trace it. That terminal on the battery switch is where you should have your charger connection. Since your engine starts we know that's a good connection. If you can't do this just take the charger output directly to the battery.

[Paddy]

Tim, the positive feed goes from the D/C positive on the charger directly through the wall and to the starter battery switch (OFF / ON only). It is connected to the ON side, along with another positive that I believe to be the cable from the starter battery (+). I need to double check. Are you saying that the positive feed from the charger needs to be either on the OFF side or directly connected to the battery (+)?


With the charger on, I get 12.6V all around, regardless of where I check the connections with the voltmeter. Not sure if the PO was lazy or someone told him otherwise, but he decided to use connections closer to the charger than run straight shots to each battery. I can't believe he owned the boat since new and lived with this problem, hence the reason I think the charger might be acting up.

[crowra]

Rob,

I re-did the drawing (again) and took out your charger from charging your start battery. That's what I get for rushing! You already have terminal 1 jumped to 2 (on the charger). Remove the cable on #3 and jump it to 2 so the charger (or alternator) is only charging the house batteries. Your Echo Charger will charge your starting battery from you house batteries. The Echo Charger is designed to charge through the three phases of charging (bulk, absorption, float) based on the voltage received to your house batteries. That is how mine is set up. If your start battery is only charging in the 'both' position, then it will be charged at the same rate as your house batteries and will seriously shorten the life of your starting battery since it charges at a different rate than your house batteries. The 'both' position should only be used in an emergency in case your starting battery dies and you need to start your engine from your house batteries.

Yes, float charge will be around 13.5 volts then decrease as the batteries fully charge to 12.7. Think of it like filling a gallon water jug. You can fill most of the jug with the water turned all the way on but need to decrease the water flow to fill the remaining 10% or so.

Panhdjoe: Agree gen and shore power should not power AC circuit(s) at the same time. But you shouldn't be able to do that anyway. You should have a switch that only allows either generator or shore or off (when underway).