Pilot House Rot

[Jay Knoll]

Another chance to excel! Thought I saw a "little problem" around the side windows, when I finally got one off (who would put 5200 on a window frame?) I discovered that the balsa core was pretty much rotted right down to the base of the pilot house.

Lots of work ahead, and while I've got the window out I thought I'd clean it up and replace the tracks. I've got metal windows, anyone have experience with getting those tracks out and finding replacements?

Thanks for the help

Jay

[Vic K]

Jay,

I went through the same thing. Ended up using the double track channel from Beckson. It has a nice tight grip on the 1/4 inch glass. Have you checked the joint between the pilot house and cabin top? You might find an unwanted surprise there also. The joint on my boat was covered by a strip of teak.
Vic

[Jay Knoll]

Vic

Yeah I suspect that I'm going to find something there as well but I'm doing it one step at a time. Do you have a part number for the Beckson track? How did you remove the track from the frame, is yours metal as well?

Jay

[Vic K]

My window frames were teak. I had to rebuild all my frames. I believe Jamestown or Hamilton Marine stock them or you can call Beckson direct . Good luck.
Vic

[Mark Deeser]

Getting ready to start a window project as well, hoping not to find any 5200.

[Jay Knoll]

Just to give you some idea of what I found, I've cleaned it out as best I could, let it dry and am started applying WEST system to the bottom of the cavity.

[Vic K]

Jay,
After removing the rot out I ripped some treated 2 x 4 stock to fit the void. Then fit the wood inside the cavity with a mixture or epoxy and silica using clamps. I did this with all the windows. Just one approach.

Vic

[Jay Knoll]

Vic

That is exactly what I'm planning on doing, except I have some left over exterior ply that I'm running thru my planer to get to size. I wanted to try to seal up the bottom of the cavity as best as I can before I start inserting the wood. Rain today so I guess I'll work on cleaning off the 5200 from the window and trim strip

Jay

[JT48348]

Jay: Thanks for the pictures. Have u considered foam as a core material? I was under the impression that treated lumber 1) contained moisture so u have to be sure its dry and 2) resin may have a problem bonding to treated lumber?

Vic:I may be totally wrong, but thats what i always thought. I've always used plywood, foam,or masonite (like for pegboard) as a coring material. Did you have any issues

I like your idea of closing off the bottom, then filling the void. Will you thicken the epoxy? And if so with what?

[Jay Knoll]

Hi JT

I've thought about foam but am concerned about it causing some bulging as it expands, The wood I'm using has a 8-10% moisture content (nice to have a meter) and West system will penetrate it nicely. I'm going to coat the wood with the WEST system before I put it in the cavity, let it kick and then apply another coat as I insert the wood in the cavity.

Getting the 5200 off the window frame has been a tough job. I tried a heat gun and scraper, it hardly budged the stuff. Acetone didn't touch it. Finally bought some DeBond from West Marine

http://www.westmarine.com/buy/marine-fo ... --12222295

expensive as heck but works great, I followed it with some Goo Be Gone and I'm down to clean metal/original paint finish on the frame.

I'm planning on painting the frames the same color as the repaired pilot house, thinking I'll do it a side at a time to get the repair done and the base coats in place and then do a final "show coat" to even things out when I've got the other window(s) repaired. Sorry, pics don't really show the progress that well, but they are now 5200 free!

[sail149]

Hi
Have you thought about getting "real"powerboat windows with metal frames made up and installing them and get away from all the wood? There are some good manufacturers out there ..but they are relatively expensive.
Unfortunately they are cheaper if you get them with rounded corners.....
Has anybody done that before ?

Defiantly stay away from any sort of expanding foam.
They are much better than they used to be but they can be a real sponge and absorbed a lot of water....however closed cell they say. That even true for proper foam core that is a PVC based produce not urethane. But I would still use that in preference to expanding foam.
Also you don't really need to use expensive west system epoxy Here.
It not a big structural issue, polyester resins will work very well and are much cheaper and can be easily filled with anything from micro balloons to calcium carbonate ! Anything dry. It's a little smelly to use but the rest of the boat is made with polyester resin....so why change now in a low load place.
Warren

[Jay Knoll]

Hi Warren

Guess I wasn't clear, the windows are metal so I'm going to repaint them once I've got them cleaned up.

I'm sticking with the West System because I am comfortable using it and already have the metered pumps so I don't have to fuss with measuring. There won't be a lot because I'm filling with void with West saturated ply which will give the mounting screws something to grab on to.

Slow but sure, we had a rainy weekend and of course the plastic that I had covering the open window blew away and water got into the cavity. So, there is new plastic up with duct tape and I've got cardboard box pieces in the void to absorb any water while I let the sun bake the cabin side.

[JT48348]

When I say foam, I am referring to divinycell or airex. Thats not expanding. I'm talking about structural foam for boat building.

I'm not talking about Great Stuff from Home Depot.

[Jay Knoll]

Thanks JT that makes sense, guess I'll look for a local supplier. But, will the foam hold screws? The window frame is screwed into the side of the boat but the fiberglass isn't thick enough to give a good purchase. I'll need a wood core to let me tighten the screws. Don't know if screws will seat in foam or merely chew it up resulting in no purchase.

Jay

[JT48348]

Jay: I havent actually done this using the foam, so take it with a grain of salt, but I have done it with plywood and masonite in different situations.

I would take the foam and precut it it into pieces that will fit into your voids. Dry fit them. Then wet out the foam peices with epoxy. You may have to experiment with thickening or not. Then you put the foam pieces wet into your void, and top it off with more epoxy. You are substituting foam for plywood coring.

You will then have a subtrate you should be able to screw into. The whole idea of the foam is it absorbs the expoy and serves as a water resistent core.