NADA Guides Discussion

[NJRobert]

That is a great idea! I have been trying to sell my 2007 28 Newport for some time now. Tried everything, including ebay. I live on the coast in central New Jersey. There are at least 8 Albins that I know of, that I see out there in the ocean with me every weekend. I am having no luck at all. I believe that I am the lowest priced 07 with all of it's options right now ( I would like 120K but would be willing to "talk"). I am going to try your idea and hope that it works. The boat is "mint" and I know that all I need is the right client base for it.

Robert

[jsa3107]

For what this is worth
I am looking for a Albin 28 TE I have been for over a month
By what I see the used asking prices on the Albins are just to high
If you take a 2007 as said above the seller is asking 120K
But if you go to Nada Guide and look at what the RETAIL is on a 2007 it is 79K plus options(and you can figure the options at 40% to 50% of retail)
So that 2007 has a RETAIL value of about 92K Again thats retail
And who is going to pay retail, If you want to sell the boat with a retail of 92K you need to be in the 75K range in this market and economy
And yes I know many people have paid to much and now have to deal with that but again it is just the way it is
And now add the time of year and it gets harder to sell them

I dont say this to hurt any feelings only to say why boats dont sell........
If anyone has one to sell
Jsa3107@aol.com

[NJRobert]

There must be a reason as to why you cannot find a 28TE Albin at the prices you are suggesting. If you really take a look at what 2007 Newports are selling for, you will see that they are all around the same price point, give or take a little. NADA in Spanish means "nothing". I doubt that you will find any '07 for what they are claiming, unless it's severely beaten up. The boat you are referring to is my boat and it is a "creampuff". There is room for negotiation, obviously, but 79-86k is not an option on this one, and I doubt on any other. Good luck in your search.

[RicM]

I agree that NADA means nothing. The only thing that matters is the price that a buyer is willing to pay. Find me an 07 28TE for $75K with a Yanmar, in good shape, and any configuration, flush deck, engine box, Gatsby, Newport & I will buy it cash tomorrow, cash. It ain't gonna happen. Just like selling a house, if it sells in a week, the price was too low. On the market 6 months....the price was too high and the carrying costs for 6 months probably ate up the premium the seller was hoping to get. Get real, listen to any offers. Don't be insulted if they are low, just be firm and polite and say no if the offer doesn't meet your needs. You are not obligated to sell anything to anyone until you accept the deposit and sign the P&S. The market doesn't care about you, your needs, what you paid or what you owe or what you feel it's worth. It doesn't care about NADA. It doesn't believe in Jesus. (Whoops, going all John Lennon on you there). It's just about the money. Don't make it personal or a matter of pride. If nobody will pay you what you want it doesn't mean they are wrong, it just means they ain't got the dough re me.

[NJRobert]

Excuse me but why are you attacking me?

[RicM]

I apologize, it's not an attack. I often find that both buyers and sellers have emotional baggage attached to their buying and selling. Money and markets have no emotion. If you can't sell, your price is too high. If you can't buy, you are short in the escarole bin. That's all. As I re-read my post I rather think I am supporting your position, that NADA does, indeed, mean nothing. You have your price, if no one meets it, don't sell. Seems simple and straight forward to me. PM me directly if I have offended in some way and will try to explain further.

[RobS]

Excuse me but why are you attacking me?

NJ Robert,

After seeing your "attacking me" reply I read Ric's post 2 more times. I sincerely do not believe there was any attack there and, as Ric went on to say, he supports you that NADA is inaccurate...

[DougSea]

Excuse me but why are you attacking me?

NJ Robert,

After seeing your "attacking me" reply I read Ric's post 2 more times. I sincerely do not believe there was any attack there and, as Ric went on to say, he supports you that NADA is inaccurate...

I actually read Ric's post as being in SUPPORT of NJ Roberts comments.

This site is a unique place on the Internet...we're pretty nice to each other! Even RobS!!

[jsa3107]

In no way was my post in any way trying to give anyone a hard time or to run anyone down
I was simply pointing out I would like to buy a used Albin 28
I have to use some guide to find value in the boat
I like anyone doesnt want to over pay
Yes you can see online a lot of boats are over Nada Guide prices but most have been on the market for months and years
So if Nada is bad what should be used to figure value?
And I assume Nada is taking the current market conditions into account and I understand most current owner are fighting the fact they paid to much..
All said with all due respect.....

[dvlyon]

I searched ten months looking for a boat that was around my price point of $50-$60K. I started a spreadsheet that contained boat color, price, year, motor type, electronics, location, etc... From this I was able to establish what an Albin 28 TE was "worth". I ended up finding a boat close to home for $35K on Craig's List. It wasn't exactly what I wanted but at that price I can afford to make it so. She looks like a $120K boat and I love her just the same.

[Seaslug44]

I can tell you something interesting about NADA... almost every time a manufacturer stops production of a model, NADA almost immediately deflates all values for all model years without any regard for what is actually taking place with supply/demand in the real market. This is true not only for boats but for automobiles. I've been watching NADA and its competitors make this mistake for decades. Some examples... Buick Regal Grand National, Pontiac Transam/Chevy Camaro (during the years right after the model was taken out of production), Dodge Daytona, Oldsmobile 442, 31' Bertram, 29' Phoenix and some of the Chris Craft models from the late 70's & 80's. These are all examples where NADA severely reduced the listed retail value yet not one of these sold on average for anything less than amounts that were 40 - 70% higher than NADA claimed they should sell. Albins fall right in that same category. You won't find many Albins selling close to the values that NADA lists just as you will not find any of the models listed above selling anywhere near their NADA book value.

The TRUE gauge is not what NADA says a model should sell for but what a model has actually sold for during recent months. Any licensed broker with a Yachtworld.com account can run a report using their access portals at the Yachtworld.com website. You see, after a listed boat is sold on that website, the selling broker closes out and removes the listing by reporting the date and amount the boat sold for. All this information is stored on their website in a data base so that in the future, their participating brokers (which is 99.6% of all marine brokers in business today) can use that sales info as a guideline/starting point to determine the asking prices for new listings. Yes, they inflate the costs slightly but the reality is, these asking prices are not "wishful" or "hopeful" thoughts. They are REALISTIC based upon what the market has been willing to pay for similar specimens during recent months.

[jsa3107]

Well me as a buyer has to have something to go by and all I have is Nada
I would also like to see recent sales but I have a feeling there arent many and the 28s that sold I would bet are few and far between and might have sold for less then you think
I think Nada is using the fact that boat sales are slow and if you want to sell they are showing what it takes to sell any boat
I mean they have to be somewhat correct it is the job to be correct
All I am getting at again is I dont want to over pay and when I decide to sell I am behind in value
Thanks for all your thoughts
This is to the above post about Nada being tough on past models wouldnt it be safe to conclude that past models would go down sharply in price after all if they were in demand they wouldnt be past models?

[RobS]

All I am getting at again is I don't want to over pay and when I decide to sell I am behind in value

As far as over-paying, if you want the boat, then you have no choice but to pay what someone is willing to let one go for, not what a book says it "should" go for. So you have to look at as many boats as you can in whatever time frame you are willing to wait. Then pull the trigger on the best deal. That's the best way to protect yourself from getting into something behind in value. Otherwise, you're gonna find yourself left with a book and no boat.

As far as being behind in value, expect some loss but shopping patiently and thoroughly and good negotiating skills should keep that within reason. I feel I can get now what I paid for her in 2007 since, although she is 3 years older, she is unquestionably a better boat now than she was then. However, I would not recover the upgrades and extras I have added.

[NJRobert]

My dealer recently sold a 2000 28TE for 79K. You can indeed find them at the 79-86k price point, but the model year is going to be pre-2002. I have been doing my homework for the past 12 months on these boats. Sometimes demand is created by lack of inventory, which is usually the case. In my situation, I am looking to sell my boats because of lack of family interest, not enough time to enjoy all of the extras that were added on to it, and an interest in downsizing to fit my current lifestyle, not because I don't like it. On the contrary, I love it! I have had many offers in that double digit category mentioned above, but right now the '07 models, especially those "loaded" and in the condition that mine is, are not warranting that justification.....yet. Who knows what the future will bring.

[Pitou]

FWIW ... NADA puts out 3 different books ... one for dealers, one for banks and one for insurance companies. All have differing values. I have seen all three together at once at the Admiral's insurance agency .... and again from a friend who is a dealer who pulls out one book for trade-ins and a different book to support sale prices to buyers. All the books show retail and trade-in and leave alot of wiggle room for condition & upgrades. I've never cared for NADA and have never used it. I have found the BUC Book to be more reliable, but not always accurate and that's is the one insurance companies use. Both NADA & BUC get their information from sales information turned in by dealers. Many dealers do not submit sales and private sales are not accepted or included. This drasticaly skews any guide. For any buyer ... do what feels comfortable and go boating! That's where I'm headed.